I'm going to be TRing Winnar once I can pike/get killed by rats my way to 20.  I'd like to do a rogue monk build (PL will be rogue) like Breaken's Onimaru.  Of course when I ask him what the build was, he doesn't remember.  ARG!  I'd like to use handwraps and get the most out of sneak attack.  What do you guys think the level split should be as well as feats?  Are there any PrE's for either class that I should shoot for?  Any help would be much appreciated!

ETA:  Please don't give me a crazy gear-dependent toon as Winnar is seriously terribad and will push the TR button as soon as she hits 20.  I'm cool with GS as I don't have a problem getting Shroud shit for her, but the thought of putting her in Amrath, let alone do ToD enough times to get the ring I want, literally makes me sweat.

2nd edit:  Tomes are not an issue, so feel free to include those if needed.  :)

I've seen some good 8M/12R builds or is that Visa Versa.  With those new SS (Dex to Hit and Damage) you could possibly screw around with a Dex build that goes Ninja Spy. 


wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2012 at 12:48pm:

ETA:  Please don't give me a crazy gear-dependent toon as Winnar is seriously terribad and will push the TR button as soon as she hits 20.  I'm cool with GS as I don't have a problem getting Shroud shit for her, but the thought of putting her in Amrath, let alone do ToD enough times to get the ring I want, literally makes me sweat.

Monk DPS is very much tied to rings but you can always get them next life.

Thanks for the help, Jeffy.  I can't wear the monk rings till level 18 anyway, right?  So I'm not super concerned about picking up ToD rings until my level up on the second life.

wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2012 at 1:23pm:

Thanks for the help, Jeffy.  I can't wear the monk rings till level 18 anyway, right?  So I'm not super concerned about picking up ToD rings until my level up on the second life.

We can get you the ring and belt from the challenges. If you have the ring from crystal cove it is good to.

stainer wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2012 at 1:30pm:

We can get you the ring and belt from the challenges. If you have the ring from crystal cove it is good to.

I have the ring, but it's on Cellebrian.  It's just a placeholder until she gets her ToD ring, though. 

I have a 12 Monk/7 Rogue/1 Fighter (or, I did until I TRed her). I imagine 13 Rogue/6 Monk/1 Fighter would work similarly well. Ninja Spy I plus either Acrobat II (for run speed and knockdown immunity) or Assassin II.

Probably STR-based human for HV: Damage IV sexiness with good wisdom for Stunning Fist awesomesauce.

I like monks more than rogues so this one is more monk than rogue.  12/8 mnk/rog to be exact.

Lawful Neutral Halfling (human works just as well but I think they dance funny)
Stats 15/15/15/8/15/8 with a +2 Dex and Int tome at 7 all levelups into strength

Level 1 Rogue
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Rogue
Feat: (Selected) Two Weapon Fighting 
Levels 2-10 Monk
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Dodge 
Feat: (Selected) Stunning Fist
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Toughness
Feat: (Monk Path) Path of Inevitable Dominion: Fists of Darkness
Feat: (Selected) Power Attack
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Improved Sunder
Feat: (Selected) Improved Two Weapon Fighting
Levels 11-15 Rogue
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Bludgeoning Weapons
Feat: (Selected) Cleave
Levels 16-18 Monk
Feat: (Selected) Greater Two Weapon Fighting
Rest Rogue

I backloaded the rogue levels to let you take better advantage of the skill points and also unlock touch of death by level 10.  Feats are set up to allow Ninja Spy and Assassin to be selected as soon as the class levels are high enough.

[edit]Realized I had 15 charisma in there like this was a 41 point build or something.[/edit]

Check out the 18/2 rogue monk build that Wowo posted in the Specialist(?) Forum. I'm thinking of doing it for dukkha soon, it just looks like so much fun.

Maxwell Edison wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2012 at 3:47pm:

I like monks more than rogues so this one is more monk than rogue.  12/8 mnk/rog to be exact. Lawful Neutral Halfling (human works just as well but I think they dance funny) Stats 15/15/15/8/15/15 with a +2 Dex and Int tome at 7 all levelups into strength Level 1 Rogue Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Rogue Feat: (Selected) Two Weapon Fighting  Levels 2-10 Monk Feat: (Monk Bonus) Dodge  Feat: (Selected) Stunning Fist Feat: (Monk Bonus) Toughness Feat: (Monk Path) Path of Inevitable Dominion: Fists of Darkness Feat: (Selected) Power Attack Feat: (Monk Bonus) Improved Sunder Feat: (Selected) Improved Two Weapon Fighting Levels 11-15 Rogue Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Bludgeoning Weapons Feat: (Selected) Cleave Levels 16-18 Monk Feat: (Selected) Greater Two Weapon Fighting Rest Rogue I backloaded the rogue levels to let you take better advantage of the skill points and also unlock touch of death by level 10.  Feats are set up to allow Ninja Spy and Assassin to be selected as soon as the class levels are high enough.

Oooh I really like that.  Is Improved Sunder really needed, though?

Thanks, Blank, I will check that out!

wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2012 at 4:55pm:

Oooh I really like that.  Is Improved Sunder really needed, though? Thanks, Blank, I will check that out!

He did once and done elites for his entire run. He was trying to maintain viable ac while staying str based and solod pretty much everything. He's sitting at a 49sf dc and close to that on sb as well. Stun + 18 rogue sa dmg = fast deaths.

i'd go 8 rogue, 6 monk 6 paladin.

level 1 as rogue, then the 6 monk, then 6 paladins, then rest of levels rogue.

if your Tring at cap anyway, shadowfade is awesome, paladin saves will be usefull, along with the dos pre. you'll have decent hp. once you get your vampiric handwraps enjoy stunning and sneak attacking mobs whilst you get the rest of the gimpy rogue levels.

build for ac till gianthold, rely on umd afterwards, and you'll cap easily enough.

Not as useful as it would be to a monk with quivering palm, but reduced fortification and AC are always nice.  To make the most of it you could grab stunning blow instead of cleave as both those are fortitude saves, but depending on gear, your strength might be too low to really take advantage of it.  Either way make sure you make yourself an epic spare hand.

wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2012 at 3:49pm:

Check out the 18/2 rogue monk build that Wowo posted in the Specialist(?) Forum. I'm thinking of doing it for dukkha soon, it just looks like so much fun.

When you get a chance, can you please post the link?  I can't seem to find it.

ETA: Nevermind, found it.  I really hate half elf, so I will probably go with something else.  :'(

http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=353750 if anyone was curious.

wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2012 at 5:24pm:

When you get a chance, can you please post the link?  I can't seem to find it. ETA: Nevermind, found it.  I really hate half elf, so I will probably go with something else.  :'(

With nose 2 and ears 2, putting a pair of goggles on really helps the weird look. It's the cheekbones that's throwing off the face.

Also, I'm sure the build will work as human if you prefer.

wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2012 at 7:05pm:

With nose 2 and ears 2, putting a pair of goggles on really helps the weird look. It's the cheekbones that's throwing off the face. Also, I'm sure the build will work as human if you prefer.

Hmm, the more I look at it, the more I like it.  I do enjoy making ugly characters, so helf would be a nice addition to my ugly bitches.

wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2012 at 7:20pm:

Hmm, the more I look at it, the more I like it.  I do enjoy making ugly characters, so helf would be a nice addition to my ugly bitches.

With goggles:
http://i953.photobucket.com/albums/ae20/nick22490/ScreenShot00176.jpg



Without goggles:
http://i953.photobucket.com/albums/ae20/nick22490/ScreenShot00177.jpg

Stop making that duckface.

Maxwell Edison wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2012 at 9:24pm:

Stop making that duckface.

I know :-/

It's kinda disappointing that I love my arty, but she looks like fucking ke$ha and la rue had a sick lovechild with AIDS.

This one looks fun, too:
http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=348658

aDifferentHandle wrote on Feb 4^th, 2012 at 7:53pm:

This one looks fun, too: http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=348658

Quote:

"This is my attempt at making a very strong melee DPS build for my final life for my main toon. The main objective of the build is as high damage as possible, with no trap skills or UMD, just pure damage. "

I'm just gonna stop reading there.

What's the advantage of the 12/8 split?  At Monk 7 you get the third martial arts feat, and at rogue 13 you get a second rogue feat.    I'd probably frontload the monk levels to get the three feats.   

Yeah, I get that 5 minutes after either the 13 or the 7 you're TRing.

The trap skills don't cost you much,  I've never gotten why people bother making rogues that can't handle traps.

Cabocleer wrote on Feb 5^th, 2012 at 10:58am:

What's the advantage of the 12/8 split?  At Monk 7 you get the third martial arts feat, and at rogue 13 you get a second rogue feat.    I'd probably frontload the monk levels to get the three feats.    Yeah, I get that 5 minutes after either the 13 or the 7 you're TRing. The trap skills don't cost you much,  I've never gotten why people bother making rogues that can't handle traps.

Idiots shouldn't comment on builds.  The third monk feat is level 6. 

last i checked monk 7's main advantage is wholeness of body, void 2, and improved recovery 2

monk 8 gets you your next die step.

if your going to argue a 13/7 split do it for the right reasons.

wrote on Feb 4^th, 2012 at 8:37pm:

I'm just gonna stop reading there.

He has an 18/2 rogue alt. I see where he is coming from.
I agree that no umd is a bit silly, but probably it can fit in easily.

The build has a certain full retard aspect, indeed.

Wowo's build is good, but it does suffer from low hp.

Anyone with 2+ rogue or arty levels and no UMD for heal scrolls, should just fuck of and die.

Quote:

"This is my attempt at making a very strong melee DPS build for my final life for my main toon. The main objective of the build is as high damage as possible, with no trap skills or UMD, just pure damage. "

I read that as maximising the build's DPS and that trap skills and UMD were not a primary consideration, but that full points would still be invested in Search/Disable/UMD because it would be too colossally stupid to do otherwise.

That may not be the intent of the quote, but I just can't bring myself to think so poorly of another human being.

popejubal wrote on Feb 6^th, 2012 at 8:07am:

That may not be the intent of the quote, but I just can't bring myself to think so poorly of another human being.

Try harder.

Epoch wrote on Feb 5^th, 2012 at 11:21am:

Idiots shouldn't comment on builds.  The third monk feat is level 6.

HALP ME EPOCH!!!  So should I do a 14/6 split?

wrote on Feb 6^th, 2012 at 11:39am:

HALP ME EPOCH!!!  So should I do a 14/6 split?

nah 14 rogue is meh aswell

13rogue,6monk 1 ranger (sprintboost)

Finally settled on my final life on Bojax as a 13Rogue/6Pally/1Monk. 

Solo's anything made of meat very well and would do fine vs undead if I invested some of those 40+ devil scales I have ratholed in the bank into a pair of 3x pos weapons. 

End game will be sitting just under 600HP and an unbuffed AC of 77 that easily reaches the low 100's.  Has good threat generation at +150% for holding aggro if tanking and saves are off the chart.  13d6+22 for every sneak attack landed and GS Radiance weapons make sure there are lots of blinded mobs.  Full Rogue skills +UMD and enough points left over to customize to taste. 

Gear layout is a little rough though with 3 Chrono pieces (helm/bracers/gloves) and a Grim's bracelet plus the Frenzied Berserker TOD set.

Munkenmo wrote on Feb 6^th, 2012 at 11:54am:

nah 14 rogue is meh aswell 13rogue,6monk 1 ranger (sprintboost)

I just want to do rogue and monk, not looking for any other splashes.

13 rogue, 6 monk, 1 wizard to qualify for Arcane Archer, obvs.

13 Rogue/ 6 monk/1 cleric

Half elf with Arcane dilli.

Self healing arcane archer with 10,000 stars.

Invelios wrote on Feb 6^th, 2012 at 2:38pm:

13 Rogue/ 6 monk/1 cleric Half elf with Arcane dilli. Self healing arcane archer with 10,000 stars.

What's the benefit of Cleric over Artficer?

wrote on Feb 6^th, 2012 at 1:50pm:

I just want to do rogue and monk, not looking for any other splashes.

ok well 14th level of rogue gets you
- next tier of sneak attack accuracy
- tier 2 (last tier) extra action boost.

7th level of monk gets you
- wholeness of body
- 20% healing amp
- void 2

neither of these two levels really does anything for you, but since you don't want to splash 1 more class, personally i'd go the 7th level of monk, just so i can sit on my ass and heal.

Munkenmo wrote on Feb 6^th, 2012 at 3:36pm:

neither of these two levels really does anything for you, but since you don't want to splash 1 more class, personally i'd go the 7th level of monk, just so i can sit on my ass and heal.

Healamp wins, hands down.
On a rogue, I usually do not have the APs for tier2 of the action boosts anyway.

aDifferentHandle wrote on Feb 6^th, 2012 at 3:26pm:

What's the benefit of Cleric over Artficer?

None, I was being sarcastic honestly.

aDifferentHandle wrote on Feb 6^th, 2012 at 3:38pm:

Healamp wins, hands down. On a rogue, I usually do not have the APs for tier2 of the action boosts anyway.

Woozles are very confusels.

Oakianus wrote on Feb 6^th, 2012 at 2:28pm:

13 rogue, 6 monk, 1 wizard to qualify for Arcane Archer, obvs.

Invelios wrote on Feb 6^th, 2012 at 2:38pm:

13 Rogue/ 6 monk/1 cleric Half elf with Arcane dilli Self healing arcane archer with 10,000 stars.

I hate you guys. :(

I made a 13/7 rogue/monk and am going to try out thief acro on her. She's still level 5 and I haven't done much with her though, so I honestly can't say how it's working out. I have her build somewhere though. When I find it I'll post it so that people can tell me I'm an idiot (in this case, probably true).

Grace wrote on Feb 6^th, 2012 at 6:36pm:

I made a 13/7 rogue/monk and am going to try out thief acro on her. She's still level 5 and I haven't done much with her though, so I honestly can't say how it's working out. I have her build somewhere though. When I find it I'll post it so that people can tell me I'm an idiot (in this case, probably true).

You said TA; but are you going to use QStaffs 24/7?
I'm always a bit reluctant to give up SA damage on offhand procs by going THF.
Situationally, I think that THFing is justified, but I think I'd make my Acrobat a handwrap-user for most of the fights.

aDifferentHandle wrote on Feb 6^th, 2012 at 8:23pm:

You said TA; but are you going to use QStaffs 24/7? I'm always a bit reluctant to give up SA damage on offhand procs by going THF. Situationally, I think that THFing is justified, but I think I'd make my Acrobat a handwrap-user for most of the fights.

For now, qstaffs. I may change it later, but until I play her a lot more levels I won't really be able to decide. It's not like I'm expecting her to be uber with that build anyway.

wrote on Feb 6^th, 2012 at 11:39am:

HALP ME EPOCH!!!  So should I do a 14/6 split?

You shouldn't do anything that involves rogue.

Jaxx wrote on Feb 6^th, 2012 at 12:44pm:

Finally settled on my final life on Bojax as a 13Rogue/6Pally/1Monk.

That's what my main rogue runs.  Started as an Assassin / KotC, but swapped to DoS after the changes.  Extremely survivable build, he's difficult to kill for a rogue.

Cale wrote on Feb 9^th, 2012 at 4:14pm:

Extremely survivable build, he's difficult to kill for a rogue.

So, two /smacks with the axe? ;)

Belwaar wrote on Feb 9^th, 2012 at 4:17pm:

So, two /smacks with the axe? ;)

lol, 550+ hp, his lowest save is a 32, no fail heal scrolls without a gear swap, workable AC up to and including normal ToD, epic trap capable, Str based dual scimitars with 9d6 + gear + AP sneak attack.
By far the most fun I've ever had playing a rogue, and I've played a lot of rogues.

But Gawna, if you're looking for only monk and rogue, I'd suggest one of the three following:
19 rogue / 1 monk
18 rogue / 2 monk for the same effect but trading 1d6 sa for another feat
or 13 rogue / 7 monk
I'd go with the 13/7 because shadow fade is *that* good.

Shadow fade is fucking bad ass

Belwaar wrote on Feb 9^th, 2012 at 4:25pm:

Shadow fade is fucking bad ass

And it has the added bonus of making short swords ki weapons.  As she doesn't want to farm a bunch of gear, I'm assuming that also means wraps, so the ability to swap to situational SSs will be HUGE on a build that doesn't have a bunch of gear and doesn't want to farm for it.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but Winnar was a first like rogue, yes?
Tell me what you want the build to do and I'll throw one together for you.  And do you have any racial preferences?  Do you care about stealth?  Spot?  Diplo?  Bluff?  Intim?

The answer to these two questions change the build fairly significantly:
Are going to be running an elite streak, and if so do you want to be a capable trapper during that time?

Cale wrote on Feb 9^th, 2012 at 4:29pm:

And it has the added bonus of making short swords ki weapons.  As she doesn't want to farm a bunch of gear, I'm assuming that also means wraps, so the ability to swap to situational SSs will be HUGE on a build that doesn't have a bunch of gear and doesn't want to farm for it. Correct me if I'm wrong, but Winnar was a first like rogue, yes? Tell me what you want the build to do and I'll throw one together for you.  And do you have any racial preferences?  Do you care about stealth?  Spot?  Diplo?  Bluff?  Intim? The answer to these two questions change the build fairly significantly: Are going to be running an elite streak, and if so do you want to be a capable trapper during that time?

Yes, Winnar is a first life rogue.

I was thinking halfling, but I guess I'm not 100% set on it if there's a good build reason to go another race.

I do have a lot of handwraps from my other monk, so I don't have any problem with stat damagers, bursting of stunning and other wraps to use as I level up.  I'm not really considered with the skills in your list and I will probably do a hard streak.  Maybe elite depending on survivability, but I'm pretty awful at DDO so I don't want to have my heart set on elite. :(

I do like the 13/7 idea, Cale!  I'd like to be able to do traps and I'll also be bumping UMD.  Thanks for your help!  And sorry it took me so long to see your response - oopsie!

wrote on Feb 16^th, 2012 at 10:11pm:

Yes, Winnar is a first life rogue. I was thinking halfling, but I guess I'm not 100% set on it if there's a good build reason to go another race. I do have a lot of handwraps from my other monk, so I don't have any problem with stat damagers, bursting of stunning and other wraps to use as I level up.  I'm not really considered with the skills in your list and I will probably do a hard streak.  Maybe elite depending on survivability, but I'm pretty awful at DDO so I don't want to have my heart set on elite. http://www.ddovault.com/Images/Smoak.png I do like the 13/7 idea, Cale!  I'd like to be able to do traps and I'll also be bumping UMD.  Thanks for your help!  And sorry it took me so long to see your response - oopsie!

Let's face it. You got distracted. It's ok. You're a girl. It happens.

This is what I did with mine:


Quote:

Level 20 Lawful Neutral Drow Female (7 Monk / 13 Rogue) Hit Points: 278 Spell Points: 0 BAB: 14/14/19/24 Fortitude: 12 Reflex: 17 Will: 11               Starting      Ending     Feat/Enhancement Abilities    Base Stats   Base Stats    Modified Stats (28 Point)    (Level 1)    (Level 20)      (Level 20) Strength           15             22                22 Dexterity          14             16                19 Constitution       14             16                16 Intelligence       12             14                14 Wisdom             12             14                14 Charisma           10             12                12 Tomes Used +2 Tome of Strength used at level 7 +2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7 +2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7 +2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7 +2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7 +2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7               Starting      Ending    Feat/Enhancement              Base Skills  Base Skills  Modified Skills Skills       (Level 1)    (Level 20)      (Level 20) Balance            2              4                10 Bluff              0              1                1 Concentration      2              3                3 Diplomacy          0              1                1 Disable Device     n/a            n/a              n/a Haggle             0              1                3 Heal               1              2                2 Hide               2              4                4 Intimidate         0              1                1 Jump               2              6                10 Listen             1              2                4 Move Silently      2              4                4 Open Lock          n/a            n/a              n/a Perform            n/a            n/a              n/a Repair             1              2                2 Search             1              2                8 Spot               1              2                8 Swim               2              6                6 Tumble             n/a            n/a              n/a Use Magic Device   n/a            n/a              n/a Level 1 (Rogue) Feat: (Selected) Toughness Level 2 (Rogue) Level 3 (Rogue) Feat: (Selected) Two Handed Fighting Level 4 (Rogue) Ability Raise: STR Level 5 (Rogue) Level 6 (Rogue) Feat: (Selected) Power Attack Level 7 (Rogue) Level 8 (Rogue) Ability Raise: STR Level 9 (Rogue) Feat: (Selected) Improved Two Handed Fighting Level 10 (Rogue) Feat: (Rogue Bonus) Improved Evasion Level 11 (Rogue) Level 12 (Rogue) Ability Raise: STR Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Bludgeoning Weapons Level 13 (Rogue) Feat: (Rogue Bonus) Opportunist Level 14 (Monk) Feat: (Monk Bonus) Improved Sunder Level 15 (Monk) Feat: (Selected) Cleave Feat: ((Monk Bonus) Stunning Fist Level 16 (Monk) Ability Raise: STR Feat: (Monk Path) Path of Harmonious Balance: Fists of Light Level 17 (Monk) Level 18 (Monk) Feat: (Selected) Greater Two Handed Fighting Level 19 (Monk) Feat: (Monk Bonus) Toughness Level 20 (Monk) Ability Raise: STR Enhancement: Rogue Damage Boost I Enhancement: Rogue Damage Boost II Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost I Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost II Enhancement: Rogue Skill Boost I Enhancement: Rogue Subtle Backstabbing I Enhancement: Rogue Subtle Backstabbing II Enhancement: Way of the Clever Monkey I Enhancement: Way of the Clever Monkey II Enhancement: Monk Improved Recovery I Enhancement: Monk Improved Recovery II Enhancement: Shintao Monk I Enhancement: Unbalancing Strike Enhancement: Adept of Wind Enhancement: Adept of Rock Enhancement: Adept of Flame Enhancement: Adept of Rain Enhancement: Racial Toughness I Enhancement: Racial Toughness II Enhancement: Rogue Faster Sneaking I Enhancement: Rogue Thief-Acrobat I Enhancement: Rogue Thief-Acrobat II Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy I Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training I Enhancement: Rogue Wrack Construct I Enhancement: Rogue Wrack Construct II Enhancement: Improved Balance I Enhancement: Improved Balance II Enhancement: Improved Disable Device I Enhancement: Improved Disable Device II Enhancement: Improved Disable Device III Enhancement: Improved Disable Device IV Enhancement: Improved Open Lock I Enhancement: Improved Open Lock II Enhancement: Improved Search I Enhancement: Improved Search II Enhancement: Improved Search III Enhancement: Improved Search IV Enhancement: Improved Spot I Enhancement: Improved Spot II Enhancement: Improved Spot III Enhancement: Improved Spot IV Enhancement: Improved Tumble I Enhancement: Improved Tumble II Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity I Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity II Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity III Enhancement: Rogue Wand and Scroll Mastery I Enhancement: Rogue Wand and Scroll Mastery II

Keep in mind that I just adapted a drow toon I was already messing with, because I hadn't tried drow yet. If I were you, I'd just make it a human and tweak the stats and enhancements for that.

I stopped reading at drow with 278 hp.  ;D

P.S.  I think I want to go dark monk for ToD.

wrote on Feb 17^th, 2012 at 1:20pm:

I stopped reading at drow with 278 hp.  ;D P.S.  I think I want to go dark monk for ToD.

Lol well, as I said, I did this with a drow because I was messing around with a drow originally for a rogue and then decided to try this. If I was actually looking to make a rogue/monk, I'd use either halfling or human. Apart from that though, and even despite it, it's not been a terrible toon. If I were you, I'd go halfling, shift some things around to take guile/cunning, and have a couple more points in con and a couple less in charisma.

I went light monk on her because one of the suckiest things about being a rogue is being utter crap against undead. The light monk mitigates that a lot.

Grace wrote on Feb 17^th, 2012 at 5:25pm:

I went light monk on her because one of the suckiest things about being a rogue is being utter crap against undead. The light monk mitigates that a lot.

Gotcha.  I have Mamadapolis who is a light monk, so I just want to try it the other way.

I doubt it's the undead - we all know you like to grasp everyone's earth dragon, Grace!  ;D

Thanks for the help, I appreciate it!  It really helps to look at other builds and be able to see what I like.

Wraps of endless light make up for everything against undead.  Light or dark doesn't matter.

If I go 13/7, does anyone have a recommendation for when to take monk levels?  I know to at least take rogue right off the bat for skillz, but is there a good way to take the levels?  I'd like to take monk relatively early (by early, I mean that I don't want to do 13 levels of rogue and then 7 monk last) as I want to use handwraps.  I'd like to be able to fight like a monk and not do punch punch kick with handwraps on.  ;D

Unless you don't have wraps of endless light. Then it matters quite a bit.

I tried to tell the cops I was just doing a monk finishing move, but they still arrested me.

I just realized that I told you in one post that you should go human and in another you should go halfling. Blegh. Posting with a fever is bad, and I can't muster up enough focus to make a logical recommendation either way. So, boobies. That is all.

wrote on Feb 17^th, 2012 at 6:12pm:

If I go 13/7, does anyone have a recommendation for when to take monk levels?  I know to at least take rogue right off the bat for skillz, but is there a good way to take the levels?  I'd like to take monk relatively early (by early, I mean that I don't want to do 13 levels of rogue and then 7 monk last) as I want to use handwraps.  I'd like to be able to fight like a monk and not do punch punch kick with handwraps on.  ;D

Depends on your feelings on feat respecs, you can take all the monk levels up front but you might want to wait to take a level with a bonus feat until your BAB is high enough to select what you want.

wrote on Feb 17^th, 2012 at 6:12pm:

If I go 13/7, does anyone have a recommendation for when to take monk levels?  I know to at least take rogue right off the bat for skillz, but is there a good way to take the levels?  I'd like to take monk relatively early (by early, I mean that I don't want to do 13 levels of rogue and then 7 monk last) as I want to use handwraps.  I'd like to be able to fight like a monk and not do punch punch kick with handwraps on.  ;D

Rogue/monk/monk/monk/rogue

Yeah, I realized I put all my rogue and monk levels grouped in that build, but I didn't actually do that. I went rogue/monk/monk/monk/rogue and then I don't remember, I'll have to check.

wrote on Feb 17^th, 2012 at 1:20pm:

I stopped reading at drow with 278 hp.  ;D P.S.  I think I want to go dark monk for ToD.

please let me know how touch of death works out for you with less than 9 monk levels.

Munkenmo wrote on Feb 19^th, 2012 at 6:15pm:

please let me know how touch of death works out for you with less than 9 monk levels.

OMFG derp. 

wrote on Feb 16^th, 2012 at 10:11pm:

Yes, Winnar is a first life rogue. I do like the 13/7 idea, Cale!  I'd like to be able to do traps and I'll also be bumping UMD.

Since you're not planning on running an elite streak, and only planning on hard, you have two choices.

Choice 1:
If you were planning an elite run I'd say alternate rogue and monk levels:
Choice 1a:
only raise class skills, thus getting more skill points (but being -1 every other level)
Choice 1b:
use monk skill points on rogue stuff (and staying capped on rogue skills, but losing skill points overall).

Choice 2:
If you were planning on normal leveling, I'd say go:
rogue 1
monk 3
rogue +1 (2)
monk +2 (4 & 5)
rogue +1 (3)
monk +2 (6 & 7)
rogue rest (4-13)
Only raise class skills (which means you lag behind every couple of levels, then cap skills again)
This gets all of your monk abilities quickly, adding sneak attack as you go towards cap.

As you're not necessarily planning on an elite-to-cap streak, I don't think it matters much which you choose.  I prefer the second method.
I can throw something together if you want.

wrote on Feb 16^th, 2012 at 10:11pm:

I was thinking halfling,

How's this look?

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 03.11.02
DDO Character Planner Home Page 

Level 20 Lawful Good Halfling Male
(7 Monk / 13 Rogue)
Hit Points: 266
Spell Points: 0

BAB: 14/14/19/24
Fortitude: 13
Reflex: 17
Will: 14

              Starting    Feat/Enhancement
Abilities    Base Stats    Modified Stats
(34 Point)    (Level 1)      (Level 20)
Strength           15                22
Dexterity          15                17
Constitution       14                16
Intelligence       12                14
Wisdom             14                18
Charisma            8                10

Tomes Used
+2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
+2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
+2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
+2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7
+2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7

              Starting      Feat/Enhancement
             Base Skills  Modified Skills
Skills       (Level 1)      (Level 20)
Balance            6              29
Bluff              -1             7
Concentration      2              29
Diplomacy          -1             1
Disable Device     5              26
Haggle             -1             1
Heal               2              5
Hide               5              19
Intimidate         -1             1
Jump               6              21
Listen             2              7
Move Silently      6              22
Open Lock          6              24
Perform            n/a            n/a
Repair             1              3
Search             5              26
Spot               6              28
Swim               2              7
Tumble             3              7
Use Magic Device   3              24

Level 1 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+4)
Skill: Disable Device (+4)
Skill: Hide (+3)
Skill: Jump (+4)
Skill: Move Silently (+4)
Skill: Open Lock (+4)
Skill: Search (+4)
Skill: Spot (+4)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+4)
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Rogue
Feat: (Selected) Two Weapon Fighting

Level 2 (Monk)
Skill: Concentration (+5)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Stunning Fist

Level 3 (Monk)
Skill: Balance (+2)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Spot (+2)
Feat: (Selected) Dodge
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Toughness

Level 4 (Monk)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Jump (+2)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Feat: (Monk Path) Path of Inevitable Dominion: Fists of Darkness

Level 5 (Rogue)
Skill: Disable Device (+4)
Skill: Search (+4)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)

Level 6 (Monk)
Skill: Balance (+2)
Skill: Concentration (+2)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Past Life: Sneak of Shadows

Level 7 (Monk)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: \cf2Spot (+2)

Level 8 (Rogue)
Skill: Disable Device (+3)
Skill: Search (+3)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+4)

Level 9 (Monk)
Skill: Balance (+2)
Skill: Concentration (+2)
Skill: Spot (+2)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Two Weapon Fighting
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Power Attack

Level 10 (Monk)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Jump (+3)
Skill: Spot (+1)

Level 11 (Rogue)
Skill: Disable Device (+3)
Skill: Search (+3)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+4)

Level 12 (Rogue)
Skill: Concentration (+2)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+2)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+2)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Bludgeoning Weapons

Level 13 (Rogue)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+4)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)

Level 14 (Rogue)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+4)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)

Level 15 (Rogue)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+4)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Greater Two Weapon Fighting

Level 16 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+4)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)

Level 17 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+3)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Rogue Bonus) Improved Evasion

Level 18 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+2)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Sunder

Level 19 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+2)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)

Level 20 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+2)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Rogue Bonus) Opportunist
Enhancement: Rogue Damage Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Damage Boost II
Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost I Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost II
Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost III
Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost IV
Enhancement: Rogue Skill Boost I
Enhancement: Halfling Cunning I
Enhancement: Halfling Cunning II
Enhancement: Halfling Guile I
Enhancement: Halfling Guile II
Enhancement: Rogue Subtle Backstabbing I
Enhancement: Rogue Subtle Backstabbing II
Enhancement: Rogue Subtle Backstabbing III
Enhancement: Way of the Patient Tortoise I
Enhancement: Way of the Patient Tortoise II
Enhancement: Monk Improved Recovery I
Enhancement: Monk Ninja Spy I
Enhancement: Unbalancing Strike
Enhancement: Winter's Touch
Enhancement: Adept of Wind
Enhancement: Adept of Rock
Enhancement: Adept of Rain
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Rogue Assassin I
Enhancement: Rogue Assassin II
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy II
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy III
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training II
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training III
Enhancement: Improved Hide I
Enhancement: Improved Hide II
Enhancement: Improved Jump I
Enhancement: Improved Jump II
Enhancement: Improved Move Silently I
Enhancement: Improved Move Silently II
Enhancement: Improved Tumble I
Enhancement: Improved Tumble II
Enhancement: Monk Wisdom I
Enhancement: Monk Wisdom II
Enhancement: Rogue Wand and Scroll Mastery I

I really like that!  Thanks, Cale!  You're the bestamest!

Assassinate doesn't really have much benefit until assassin 3, particularly at cap.

Grace wrote on Feb 21^st, 2012 at 1:32am:

Rogue doesn't really have much benefit, particularly at cap.

Fixed this for you.

I wouldn't go for 7 monk. 6 monk is enough for the PRE. 7 monk only gives you "Wholeness of Body", but with only 7 monk levels you heal a lot faster if you simply drink heal pots instead of sitting around for 30 secs ;)

13 rogue, 6 monk, 1 fighter (for the extra feat/attack) is what I use on my accobat.

Epoch wrote on Feb 21^st, 2012 at 3:34am:

Fixed this for you.

2 rogue for evasion on a Bard works nicely. Otherwise I'd go monk.

wrote on Feb 21^st, 2012 at 5:03am:

2 rogue for evasion on a Bard works nicely. Otherwise I'd go monk.

Which isn't much benefit.  Thanks, it was covered.

Grace wrote on Feb 21^st, 2012 at 1:32am:

Assassinate doesn't really have much benefit until assassin 3, particularly at cap.

Acro requires 10ap spent on Dex enhancements that are hard to fit in and only offers redundant knockdown immunity on a build that has enough balance that he should be immune to most of them anyway.  Ninja/Acro leaves you short on AP and you have to give up too much to get both.
Assassin is easier to fit, gives 2d6 more SA, and the little used and underrated poisons offer a bonus to hit when it's needed.
In short, Assassin is superior to Acro in almost every single way on this build.

Alternately Gawna, you could start Int @ at 10 and Wis @ 15, and only take monk wisdom I.  That would free up 4ap for you and net the same stunning fist DC, but you'd have to redo the skills to compensate for the loss of 1skp every level (which wouldn't be hard to do and would net you another +3sa damage from sa training IV).

Now I'm thinking I may take the level of fighter.  What if I were to reverse it and do 12 monk/7 rogue/1 fighter?  Does that get me anything amazeballs?  Otherwise I will probably just go 13 rogue/6 monk/1 fighter.

Thanks everyone so much for your help, I really appreciate it!

I don't see a huge advantage in the 7 levels of rogue, except for being a trapper and a little SA damage.

With 13 rogue on the other hand, you'll get to pick 2 rogue feats. Improved Evasion and Opportunist are great for every build.

Thief Acrobat with Ninja Spy is a nice synergy. Amazing attack speed with quaterstaffs paired with monk saves and AC bonus rocks.

wrote on Feb 21^st, 2012 at 11:24am:

Now I'm thinking I may take the level of fighter.  What if I were to reverse it and do 12 monk/7 rogue/1 fighter?  Does that get me anything amazeballs?  Otherwise I will probably just go 13 rogue/6 monk/1 fighter. Thanks everyone so much for your help, I really appreciate it!

That's a completely different concept.
Were that the new direction you were looking to go I'd suggest 7 fighter instead of rogue.  Swap them.  Half-elf with rogue dilly and you only lose 1d6sa from the other way around, but you get better stunning and either kensai I or stalwart I instead which makes for more consistent DPS or more survivability respectively.  You'll lose trapping ability altogether (or sacrifice a lot to get it).

Break points for rogue are 1, 2, 13, 18, 19
Anything else and you're basically wasting levels.

If you go back to the 13 rogue, I may be in the minority but I recommend 7 monk over 6 monk / 1 fighter.  You have all the feats you need, and Wholeness of Body may not get used often, but it's actually quite useful.  Jidz tet-ka, drop into fire stance, WoB, fill 25-50% of your HP bar, depending on your level and gear.
Kalebrus was 13/7 before his TR, and I used WoB more often than you'd think.  Between level 10 and when you can reliably use heal scrolls, it's faster than pot healing as long as you have a moment to stop and use it.  And when the fight is over you always, and I mean always have enough ki to use it.  Kalebrus (who was a finesse build at the time) solo'd Tempest spine on elite at level 11 without using any resources at all until the final fight because of WoB.
It can be a huge help before you can use heal scrolls, and even if you don't have any ki after a fight (which almost never happens) you can just drop into sneak mode and build enough ki to use it via ninja spy.  This is, IMHO, better than a feat that you don't need because you already have enough.

wrote on Feb 21^st, 2012 at 11:24am:

Now I'm thinking I may take the level of fighter.  What if I were to reverse it and do 12 monk/7 rogue/1 fighter?  Does that get me anything amazeballs?  Otherwise I will probably just go 13 rogue/6 monk/1 fighter. Thanks everyone so much for your help, I really appreciate it!

12Monk 6Rogue 1 Fighter

Tier 3 stances
Touch of death (only with handwraps)
Abundant step
poison immunity
2 more tiers of monk innate speed
2 tiers of slowfall (it's still pretty useless at level 12 though)
tier 3 animal enhancements
tier 3 monk healing amp
ninja spy 2 (water strider, improved crit shorswords, and 2d6 sneak attack)
1 feat from fighter.
tier 1 of fighter tactics enhancements (stunning blow, trip, sunder)

You lose

4d6 sneak attack
2 rogue feats
2 trap sense
improved uncanny dodge
about 24 distributable skill points
tiers 3/4 of haste boost
subtle backstabbing tiers 2+
tiers 2+ of wrack construct
tiers 3+ sneak attack training
tiers 3+ sneak attack accuracy
the following if you were acrobat 2
10% attack speed with staves
slippery surfaces immunity
knockdown immunity

Net differences imo:
lose 2 d6 sneak attack (effectively since you'll probably take ninja spy)
lose some skill points, but can sustain max lock, umd, searh, spot, concentration, balance
slower attacking (10% slower with staves)(gain 2.5% double strike in wind)
gain 16hp
gain tier 3 ki strikes / stances (you'll only use air stance, earth will get you agro)
gain monk abilities you won't use since you'll stick with staves.
gain 1 dc to sunder or stunning blow.
loss of 1 rogue feat since you'd have taken improved evasion anyway
I can't be fucked calculating BAB but you get about 2 more.

wrote on Feb 21^st, 2012 at 11:24am:

Now I'm thinking I may take the level of fighter.  What if I were to reverse it and do 12 monk/7 rogue/1 fighter?  Does that get me anything amazeballs?  Otherwise I will probably just go 13 rogue/6 monk/1 fighter. Thanks everyone so much for your help, I really appreciate it!

13 rogue, 6monk, 1 fighter

you lose
void strike II
all consuming flame
Improved recovery tier II
2 skill points.

you gain
tier 1 tactical enhancements
1 fighter bonus feat.
2 hp

This imo is a stronger build than the 12m 6r 1f,  the loss of 10% healing amp will hurt, but inversely neither way will you have a tonne of hit points, and a heal scroll is going to do a good job of topping you off regardless.

healing amp would be offset further if you stay in fire stance for +2 str on the lower monk splash, and wear the jidz tet bracers for that juicy 25% amp. (heck or just swap it in with your umd gear)

Ugh i can't believe i'm recommending rogue levels over monk levels. I hate you.

Biggest problem with a 12mnk/6rog/1ftr build is deciding what class to take at cap.

Okay, I think I'm gonna stick with 13 rogue/7 monk.  I don't want to make Cale sob by continuing to change my mind.  ;D

I'm sensitive.  It's not a flaw and I'm not ashamed of it.

wrote on Feb 21^st, 2012 at 2:30pm:

Okay, I think I'm gonna stick with 13 rogue/7 monk.  I don't want to make Cale sob by continuing to change my mind.  ;D

woman makes up her mind?

no way.

1 Ranger
bow strength
sprint boost
favored enemy
favored enmy damage / to hit enhancement.

Sprint boost is amazeballs on a 12rogue 6 monk acrobat.

Munkenmo wrote on Feb 21^st, 2012 at 2:47pm:

1 Ranger bow strength sprint boost.

That's a much better choice than 1 fighter is.  13 rogue / 6 monk / 1 ranger.  Sprint boost, better Fort and Ref saves, one favored enemy, and no UMD needed for cure/resist wands while leveling.

NO! I MADE UP MY MIND THIS TIME AND YOU CAN'T MAKE ME DO IT!  :)

Now that you made up your mind may I suggest 13rogue/7 Paladin? or 13/6/1monk

Cale wrote on Feb 21^st, 2012 at 3:18pm:

That's a much better choice than 1 fighter is.  13 rogue / 6 monk / 1 ranger.  Sprint boost, better Fort and Ref saves, one favored enemy, and no UMD needed for cure/resist wands while leveling.

A feat is worth more, imho. I'd stick to 13/6/1 rogue/monk/fighter. 7 monk isn't as good as 6 monk plus a fighter level, imho.

JDollar wrote on Feb 21^st, 2012 at 6:14pm:

Now that you made up your mind may I suggest 13rogue/7 Paladin? or 13/6/1monk

Why you hate Gawna?

16 monk/2 rogue/2 pally

I have a great one!

20 monk/0 rogue

2 monk/18 barb

wrote on Feb 21^st, 2012 at 6:48pm:

2 monk/18 barb

This is not a rogue monk build.

Epoch wrote on Feb 21^st, 2012 at 6:54pm:

This is not a rogue monk build.

You're right. It's better as it completely removes Rogue from the equation.

wrote on Feb 21^st, 2012 at 6:38pm:

Why you hate Gawna?

I am the tempter  :-*

wrote on Feb 21^st, 2012 at 7:00pm:

You're right. It's better as it completely removes Rogue from the equation.

I want a FB monk.

Epoch wrote on Feb 21^st, 2012 at 7:49pm:

I want a FB monk.

Rage, x4 fists in wind stance, extra con and str, Sprint boost, full str to both hands, evasion, decent saves....the list goes on.

Brb, I might go play pathfinder now.

wrote on Feb 21^st, 2012 at 8:20pm:

Brb, I might go play pathfinder now.

This is better:

http://www.ruleofcool.com/

JDollar wrote on Feb 21^st, 2012 at 7:21pm:

I am the tempter  :-*

The cavern can never resist your Canadian charms.  :-*

wrote on Feb 21^st, 2012 at 2:30pm:

Okay, I think I'm gonna stick with 13 rogue/7 monk.  I don't want to make Cale sob by continuing to change my mind.  ;D

Really nice split for an Acrobat too.  If you got the Dreamspitter the fire-dark-fire Karmic Strike finisher is rather smexy.  Immunity to knockdown, traps, UMD, gimp.

You should go with enough ranger levels to get Favored Enemy: Vermin

Felgor wrote on Feb 6^th, 2012 at 12:46am:

Wowo's build is good, but it does suffer from low hp.

I got my 500 pre-madstone/no yugo pot HP now so I hope you're happy.

Geez, you'd think some people wanted to do other things with their hjealers other than watch my red bar.

I love my 18 rogue/2 monk build, it's amazing watching the vorpal fists go off with haste boost going, that alone makes that split better than any other for DPS purposes at level 20.

While leveling I went with acrobat II for the AC, move speed and knockdown immunity which was great.

TL:DR: Vorpal fists = win.

I am loving the build that Cale did for me, it is so much fun to level with!  She is like a fart away from 14 right now.

wowo wrote on Mar 20^th, 2012 at 6:16am:

I got my 500 pre-madstone/no yugo pot HP now so I hope you're happy. Geez, you'd think some people wanted to do other things with their hjealers other than watch my red bar. I love my 18 rogue/2 monk build, it's amazing watching the vorpal fists go off with haste boost going, that alone makes that split better than any other for DPS purposes at level 20. While leveling I went with acrobat II for the AC, move speed and knockdown immunity which was great. TL:DR: Vorpal fists = win.

Dying less is more dps anyway.

I would be happy if you ran New some more.

Felgor wrote on Mar 20^th, 2012 at 5:53pm:

Dying less is more dps anyway. I would be happy if you ran New some more.

Must ... Cap ... Adelaise. Then back to epics and raids. And I wouldn't die if you did your job as a hjealer and stood in the back with your eyes glued to my red bar.

wowo wrote on Mar 20^th, 2012 at 6:02pm:

Must ... Cap ... Adelaise. Then back to epics and raids. And I wouldn't die if you did your job as a hjealer and stood in the back with your eyes glued to my red bar.

That would be even riskier, as I would actually have to hard target you rather than just mass healing on myself. Close to 18 on Adel yet?

Just got XP for 17 but I should try to farm a bit more of necro I think before taking the level.

wrote on Mar 20^th, 2012 at 5:18pm:

I am loving the build that Cale did for me, it is so much fun to level with!  She is like a fart away from 14 right now.

Glad to hear it.
I had a blast when I leveled my 13/7 split as well.

Cale wrote on Mar 22^nd, 2012 at 7:26pm:

Glad to hear it. I had a blast when I leveled my 13/7 split as well.

She is so badass at traps!  And it's nice to not have to depend on SA for all dps.  Winnar on her first life did -45 damage per hit when she had aggro, so running solo was a nightmare, but the monk punches are sooo nice to have!  And she can actually stun shit!  I am a badass.  I owe you my firstborn.

wrote on Feb 4^th, 2012 at 8:37pm:

I'm just gonna stop reading there.

This.  Especially "no UMD.'  My rogue lives by UMD. Literally.  Can't do damage if you're dead.

wrote on Apr 7^th, 2012 at 2:04am:

This.  Especially "no UMD.'  My rogue lives by UMD. Literally.  Can't do damage if you're dead.

Or if you're fighting fire ellies. Amirite? :D

just posted my rogue's final build on the other forums (http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=368452).

it has a lvl of monk and it does use handwraps :)