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Epoch
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Re: Refromed Thief build - What skill?
Reply #25 - Apr 28th, 2011 at 6:59am
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Smiley




-Also, I just now noticed 'reformed' is spelled wrong in the title.
  
OnePercenter wrote on May 15th, 2014 at 9:41am:
I just read that the cat followed up by visiting the dog house later that night, dropping some Willie Pete in on the sleeping dog.  #epochsfamiliarFTW

Sim-Sala-Bim wrote on Jan 27th, 2014 at 2:09am:
It seems like Epoch never loses his popularity.
Even against donuts.
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[C] hicken [G] od
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Re: Refromed Thief build - What skill?
Reply #26 - May 2nd, 2011 at 5:57am
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Epoch wrote on Apr 28th, 2011 at 6:59am:
Smiley




-Also, I just now noticed 'reformed' is spelled wrong in the title.


Quite observant of you. I was waiting for someone to notice.  Grin

Anyhoo, I got the 32pt build and asked a few folks what they thought of it. It was considered not optimal for questing.

Id like to post it here to hear your comments and criticism as well.

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Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.9.1
DDO Character Planner Home Page 

Ftr-Rog 
Level 20 Lawful Good Human Male
(18 Fighter / 2 Rogue)
Hit Points: 334
Spell Points: 0

BAB: 19/19/24/2929
Fortitude: 13
Reflex: 13
Will: 9

              Starting      Ending     Feat/Enhancement
Abilities    Base Stats   Base Stats    Modified Stats
(32 Point)    (Level 1)    (Level 20)      (Level 20)
Strength           16             20                23
Dexterity          16             17                18
Constitution       14             14                14
Intelligence       12             12                12
Wisdom             10             10                10
Charisma            8              8                 8

              Starting      Ending    Feat/Enhancement
             Base Skills  Base Skills  Modified Skills
Skills       (Level 1)    (Level 20)      (Level 20)
Balance            7              8                9
Bluff              -1             -1               2
Concentration      2              2                5
Diplomacy          -1             -1               2
Disable Device     5              18.5             19.5
Haggle             -1             -1               -1
Heal               0              0                0
Hide               7              8                9
Intimidate         -1             -1               4
Jump               7              10               13
Listen             0              0                0
Move Silently      7              8                9
Open Lock          7              8                9
Perform            n/a            n/a              n/a
Repair             1              1                1
Search             5              19               20
Spot               4              4                5
Swim               3              6                6
Tumble             7              8                9
Use Magic Device   3              21.5             24.5

Level 1 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+4)
Skill: Disable Device (+4)
Skill: Hide (+4)
Skill: Jump (+4)
Skill: Move Silently (+4)
Skill: Open Lock (+4)
Skill: Search (+4)
Skill: Spot (+4)
Skill: Tumble (+4)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+4)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness
Feat: (Human Bonus) Two Weapon Fighting
Enhancement: Improved Disable Device I
Enhancement: Improved Open Lock I
Enhancement: Improved Search I
Enhancement: Improved Tumble I

Level 2 (Fighter)
Skill: Disable Device (+0.5)
Skill: Search (+0.5)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Oversized Two Weapon Fighting
Enhancement: Fighter Attack Boost I
Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy I
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness I

Level 3 (Fighter)
Skill: Disable Device (+0.5)
Skill: Search (+0.5)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Exotic Weapon Proficiency: Khopesh
Feat: (Selected) Iron Wiill
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Fighter Strength I
Enhancement: Rogue Improved Trap Sense I

Level 4 (Fighter)
Ability Raise: DEX
Skill: Disable Device (+0.5)
Skill: Search (+0.5)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Rogue Skill Boost I
Enhancement: Fighter Armor Mastery I
Enhancement: Improved Jump I

Level 5 (Fighter)
Skill: Disable Device (+0.5)
Skill: Search (+0.5)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Weapon Focus: Slashing Weapons
Enhancement: Fighter Attack Boost II
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness II

Level 6 (Fighter)
Skill: Disable Device (+0.5)
Skill: Search (+0.5)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Specialization: Slashing Weapons
Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost II
Enhancement: Human Adaptability Strength I

Level 7 (Fighter)
Skill: Disable Device (+0.5)
Skill: Search (+0.5)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Two Weapon Fighting
Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy II
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II

Level 8 (Fighter)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Disable Device (+0.5)
Skill: Search (+0.5)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training I
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness III

Level 9 (Fighter)
Skill: Disable Device (+0.5)
Skill: Search (+0.5)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Greater Weapon Focus: Slashing Weapons
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons
Enhancement: Fighter Kensei I

Level 10 (Fighter)
Skill: Disable Device (+0.5)
Skill: Search (+0.5)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Kensei Khopesh Mastery I
Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy III

Level 11 (Rogue)
Skill: Disable Device (+2)
Skill: Search (+3)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+5)
Enhancement: Fighter Khopesh Specialization I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy I
Enhancement: Improved Jump II
Enhancement: Improved Jump III

Level 12 (Fighter)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Disable Device (+0.5)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
Feat: (Selected) Bullheaded
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Greater Two Weapon Fighting
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness IV

Level 13 (Fighter)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+0.5)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
Enhancement: Improved Move Silently I
Enhancement: Improved Spot I
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity I

Level 14 (Fighter)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+0.5)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
Enhancement: Fighter Strength II

Level 15 (Fighter)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+0.5)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
Feat: (Selected) Greater Weapon Specialization: Slashing Weapons
Enhancement: Kensei Khopesh Mastery II
Enhancement: Fighter Kensei II
Enhancement: Improved Hide I

Level 16 (Fighter)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Disable Device (+0.5)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Dodge
Enhancement: Fighter Attack Boost III
Enhancement: Improved Balance I

Level 17 (Fighter)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+0.5)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
Enhancement: Fighter Armor Mastery II

Level 18 (Fighter)
Skill: Disable Device (+0.5)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
Feat: (Selected) Skill Focus: Use Magic Device
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Superior Weapon Focus: Slashing Weapons
Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost III
Enhancement: Fighter Armored Agility I

Level 19 (Fighter)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+0.5)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
Enhancement: Fighter Khopesh Specialization II

Level 20 (Fighter)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Disable Device (+0.5)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Power Critical
Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy IV
Enhancement: Fighter Kensei III


The point of this build is to be a tough thief. DPS TWF that can still search and disable traps.

So far some comments are that I shouldnt take OTWF too early and Power Crit is useless after Level 11. The explanations are sparse and not really something I can understand quite easily but with your help perhaps I can be more enlightened.  Wink
« Last Edit: May 2nd, 2011 at 6:01am by [C] hicken [G] od »  
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woody
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Re: Refromed Thief build - What skill?
Reply #27 - May 2nd, 2011 at 5:11pm
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[C] hicken [G] od wrote on May 2nd, 2011 at 5:57am:
Anyhoo, I got the 32pt build and asked a few folks what they thought of it. It was considered not optimal for questing.

Id like to post it here to hear your comments and criticism as well.



The point of this build is to be a tough thief. DPS TWF that can still search and disable traps.

So far some comments are that I shouldnt take OTWF too early and Power Crit is useless after Level 11. The explanations are sparse and not really something I can understand quite easily but with your help perhaps I can be more enlightened.  Wink


I would def drop OTWF. OTWF is not nessary unless you are OCD about the negative to your bab. Never taken Power Crit so while I cant talk for my self the general comments that I've heard was don't.

And if you trying to make a straight melee toon do traps and what not you are prolly better off going barb or ranger for the extra skill points. I don't believe that fighters can get the points necessary to be able to do traps/locks/search reliably enough at higher lvls. Or try a primary rogue multi-class that splashes ranger/fighter or whatnot. I'm sure they're out there.
« Last Edit: May 2nd, 2011 at 5:15pm by woody »  
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Re: Refromed Thief build - What skill?
Reply #28 - May 2nd, 2011 at 9:49pm
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woody wrote on May 2nd, 2011 at 5:11pm:
I would def drop OTWF. OTWF is not nessary unless you are OCD about the negative to your bab. Never taken Power Crit so while I cant talk for my self the general comments that I've heard was don't.

And if you trying to make a straight melee toon do traps and what not you are prolly better off going barb or ranger for the extra skill points. I don't believe that fighters can get the points necessary to be able to do traps/locks/search reliably enough at higher lvls. Or try a primary rogue multi-class that splashes ranger/fighter or whatnot. I'm sure they're out there.


What if I follow the original Reformed Thief build but use Search, UMD, Disable traps for skill points instead of getting the others?
  
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Re: Refromed Thief build - What skill?
Reply #29 - May 3rd, 2011 at 1:04am
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[C] hicken [G] od wrote on May 2nd, 2011 at 9:49pm:
What if I follow the original Reformed Thief build but use Search, UMD, Disable traps for skill points instead of getting the others?


Eating a +2 int tome would help out as that'll give you one extra point to play with for the last half of your toon. Either way it seems doable but will be gear dependent and an uphill battle to do it. You would only be able to focus on UMD,DD, and search and would not be able to put points in anything else except the lvls you take rogue.  I dont know if you'd be any good at epic or elite lvl end game content(dont feel like crunching numbers) but everything else you might be half/way decent at if you gear/buff up.
« Last Edit: May 3rd, 2011 at 1:09am by woody »  
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Epoch
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Re: Refromed Thief build - What skill?
Reply #30 - May 3rd, 2011 at 4:51am
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Take the 2 points from wisdom and put them into int.  14 int is greater then 10 wisdom.

Also, take dex from 16 to 15.  This will get you 2 more points.  Make sure to nab a +2 dex tome for imp twf and gtwf.  Usable at level 7.  DDO store or 1750 favor or tradeable from anyone really. If on argo I think I have a couple sitting in the bank.

With those 2 points I would probably drop em in to con or charisma., just cuz.

Use a +2 int tome at level 7.  After the rogue level at lvl 11 you will now be able to keep search, umd, and dd maxed.  Making you just as efficient as any rogue.

I also wouldn't grab bullheaded, iron will, or otwf.  This is just me though.
  
OnePercenter wrote on May 15th, 2014 at 9:41am:
I just read that the cat followed up by visiting the dog house later that night, dropping some Willie Pete in on the sleeping dog.  #epochsfamiliarFTW

Sim-Sala-Bim wrote on Jan 27th, 2014 at 2:09am:
It seems like Epoch never loses his popularity.
Even against donuts.
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Re: Refromed Thief build - What skill?
Reply #31 - May 4th, 2011 at 9:09am
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Epoch wrote on May 3rd, 2011 at 4:51am:
Take the 2 points from wisdom and put them into int.  14 int is greater then 10 wisdom.

Also, take dex from 16 to 15.  This will get you 2 more points.  Make sure to nab a +2 dex tome for imp twf and gtwf.  Usable at level 7.  DDO store or 1750 favor or tradeable from anyone really. If on argo I think I have a couple sitting in the bank.

With those 2 points I would probably drop em in to con or charisma., just cuz.

Use a +2 int tome at level 7.  After the rogue level at lvl 11 you will now be able to keep search, umd, and dd maxed.  Making you just as efficient as any rogue.

I also wouldn't grab bullheaded, iron will, or otwf.  This is just me though.


For the feats you mentioned, everyone seems to hate it. Any particular reason why? I hate being held or charmed and Aranticus's build seems to like it.

My toons live in Orien but thank you for the offer on the tome.
  
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Epoch
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Re: Refromed Thief build - What skill?
Reply #32 - May 4th, 2011 at 9:18am
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a +3 bonus to will saves? Just umd a FOM scroll to avoid being held.  For charmed use a protection from evil scroll/wand.  It keeps you from being mentally controlled or compulsed.  In a raid group you will have this anyways, even in some pug groups.  Well, maybe not on orien, hahahaha.
  
OnePercenter wrote on May 15th, 2014 at 9:41am:
I just read that the cat followed up by visiting the dog house later that night, dropping some Willie Pete in on the sleeping dog.  #epochsfamiliarFTW

Sim-Sala-Bim wrote on Jan 27th, 2014 at 2:09am:
It seems like Epoch never loses his popularity.
Even against donuts.
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Aranticus
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Re: Refromed Thief build - What skill?
Reply #33 - May 5th, 2011 at 9:29pm
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[C] hicken [G] od wrote on May 4th, 2011 at 9:09am:
For the feats you mentioned, everyone seems to hate it. Any particular reason why? I hate being held or charmed and Aranticus's build seems to like it.

My toons live in Orien but thank you for the offer on the tome.


because my builds are damn old and there isnt much better feats to take. its also when intimidate actually meant something and having a decent will save is important after being dispelled. different experiences will give you different perception. ie i once forgot to put on boots of anchoring after getting a haste and a banish circle was seen. i rolled low but stayed in the game. i was the tank on my dps/intimitank
« Last Edit: May 5th, 2011 at 9:29pm by Aranticus »  
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Re: Refromed Thief build - What skill?
Reply #34 - May 16th, 2011 at 10:33am
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Aranticus wrote on May 5th, 2011 at 9:29pm:
because my builds are damn old and there isnt much better feats to take. its also when intimidate actually meant something and having a decent will save is important after being dispelled. different experiences will give you different perception. ie i once forgot to put on boots of anchoring after getting a haste and a banish circle was seen. i rolled low but stayed in the game. i was the tank on my dps/intimitank


Would you consider updating this in the future? I am not sure if you still play but would love to pick your brain as I try and try to make builds on improving this
  
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Re: Refromed Thief build - What skill?
Reply #35 - May 20th, 2011 at 2:38am
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i mean are you really going to be sneaking and hiding? drop that shit and put into balance.
  

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