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Madcow430
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Licoricewhip and tanking. Could use a hand here
Jan 5th, 2012 at 4:53am
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Meet Licoricewhip, my pally:

http://my.ddo.com/character/khyber/licoricewhip/

For his third life, I chose to try out the defender PrE and take a shot at tanking.  This is one of my favorite toons to play.  I'd like to get him to a point that he is more successful at it.

This life, I've so far been enjoying the planned 18pally/2monk build.  Saves, ac etc have been suprisingly fun to play when I ignore his snail like pace in a party.  I've recently run into my first problem with him however.

He's currently level 15.  I joined an DQ Elite on two occasions with intent to operate as the punching bag.  Though I'm very suprised at the amount of times he's being hit by Lialat.  Currently, I can self buff to a max 68 ac which appears to be woefully inadequate.  So I've started this thread to get an assist on things I may have missed.  Anyway, self buffing this is what I end up with:





So, with haste and a recitation wand I end up at 68. 

I'm trying to see if I've flubbed something and could squeeze out more ac from somewhere.  Any ideas?
  
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Re: Licoricewhip and tanking. Could use a hand here
Reply #1 - Jan 5th, 2012 at 5:19am
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  • He is missing "Insight AC"
  • Deflection could be higher
  
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Re: Licoricewhip and tanking. Could use a hand here
Reply #2 - Jan 5th, 2012 at 5:52am
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Thanks for that.

I'm out of shards and low on mats to give him a min2helm.  The only source I'm aware of of +4insight that would apply to his level resides in crafting another min2. 

Had these things on the backburner waiting until he hits cap again to continue farming mats/shards.  It's right up there with getting the scrolls for a three piece abashai set for him.  Not attainable atm, but in the works...
  
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Re: Licoricewhip and tanking. Could use a hand here
Reply #3 - Jan 5th, 2012 at 5:58am
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Madcow430 wrote on Jan 5th, 2012 at 5:52am:
The only source I'm aware of of +4insight that would apply to his level resides in crafting another min2.


A Sovereign Rune of Insight also gives a +4 Insight AC
  
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Re: Licoricewhip and tanking. Could use a hand here
Reply #4 - Jan 5th, 2012 at 6:34am
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Also keep in mind that insight bonus stacks the same way dodge or exceptional bonus stacks. You can combine T1, T2 and T3 green steel insight bonus for a total bonus of +7 (or something like parry + greater parry + DT rune)
  
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Re: Licoricewhip and tanking. Could use a hand here
Reply #5 - Jan 5th, 2012 at 8:48am
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the devs wrote on Jan 5th, 2012 at 6:34am:
Also keep in mind that insight bonus stacks the same way dodge or exceptional bonus stacks. You can combine T1, T2 and T3 green steel insight bonus for a total bonus of +7 (or something like parry + greater parry + DT rune)


I'm not sure that what you're saying is correct.
  

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Re: Licoricewhip and tanking. Could use a hand here
Reply #6 - Jan 5th, 2012 at 8:54am
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popejubal wrote on Jan 5th, 2012 at 8:48am:
I'm not sure that what you're saying is correct.


I'm sorry, you're right. Got mixed up with dodge bonus  Undecided
  
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Re: Licoricewhip and tanking. Could use a hand here
Reply #7 - Jan 5th, 2012 at 9:26am
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@Madcow430

I gotta ask this -

I am working on my first 3rd life character, After level 6 I started holding levels. Your screen shot looks like you aren't holding lvls at all. Is that the case? How is that working out for you?

/multi tr noob
  

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Re: Licoricewhip and tanking. Could use a hand here
Reply #8 - Jan 5th, 2012 at 9:31am
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Yeah, the insight doesn't appear to stack that way.  Looks like you get one bonus or the other.

Taking a look at what he does have for gear, it looks like I am stuck until I garner more shards.  Have a shard of power and one supreme left in the bank.  And a set of DT plate (resistance/healing amp/empty sov) I used when forced to tank by default in his previous two lives. 

I'm thinking I'm better off with the icy raiments though over DT.  That +4 dodge is hard to compete with.  I use DT on Evandus currently.  Best I could get was +3 dodge with alchemical bonus and it was one ac less than just wearing the icy raiment.
  
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Re: Licoricewhip and tanking. Could use a hand here
Reply #9 - Jan 5th, 2012 at 9:36am
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stainer wrote on Jan 5th, 2012 at 9:26am:
@Madcow430

I gotta ask this -

I am working on my first 3rd life character, After level 6 I started holding levels. Your screen shot looks like you aren't holding lvls at all. Is that the case? How is that working out for you?

/multi tr noob


Holding levels imo is still the smartest way to TR level imo.  There was an at level titan that I rushed to get in range for.  Paid off because I got a lucky roll on a chattering ring.  However, in my impatience, I've continued taking levels as I get them til this point.

Flagging for litany, farming gianthold, and the madness chain farming will put me back at one level ahead by the time I hit the vale.

tl;dr version:  I was in a hurry to do a forum event run.  After fucking up my normal way of leveling I'm catching up with a saved level by the time I hit the vale.
  
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Re: Licoricewhip and tanking. Could use a hand here
Reply #10 - Jan 5th, 2012 at 9:40am
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Madcow430 wrote on Jan 5th, 2012 at 9:36am:
Holding levels imo is still the smartest way to TR level imo.  There was an at level titan that I rushed to get in range for.  Paid off because I got a lucky roll on a chattering ring.  However, in my impatience, I've continued taking levels as I get them til this point.

Flagging for litany, farming gianthold, and the madness chain farming will put me back at one level ahead by the time I hit the vale.

tl;dr version:  I was in a hurry to do a forum event run.  After fucking up my normal way of leveling I'm catching up with a saved level by the time I hit the vale.


Ok. Thank you.

On a first time TR, I don't really hold levels, since it is so easy to cap. I was hoping that you were finding that to be the case on a 3x+ TR.

/sadtimes
  

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Re: Licoricewhip and tanking. Could use a hand here
Reply #11 - Jan 5th, 2012 at 9:55am
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I think that if that second madness chain was run frequently enough, you could skip holding levels.  As far as pugging goes though, lfm's for it have been pretty rare.  It's possible with a dedicated group to farm those out.  They just don't appear to be good for time/xp ratio. 

It would also require more than just getting the explorers and 200 kill standard in slayer zones.
  
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Re: Licoricewhip and tanking. Could use a hand here
Reply #12 - Jan 5th, 2012 at 10:12am
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@stainer

imho levels should be held when there are still some quests, 2 levels lower than your current level, which you haven't done, yet. Bravery bonus and elite streaks makes TR'ing a lot smoother  Cheesy
  
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Re: Licoricewhip and tanking. Could use a hand here
Reply #13 - Jan 5th, 2012 at 12:03pm
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Get something with Superior Parrying (Epic Chimera's Fang is one good thing - yeah, I know you're not 20th level yet). That grants a +4 Insight Bonus to AC as well as a +4 Insight Bonus to Saves.
  

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Re: Licoricewhip and tanking. Could use a hand here
Reply #14 - Jan 5th, 2012 at 5:04pm
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stainer wrote on Jan 5th, 2012 at 9:40am:
Ok. Thank you.

On a first time TR, I don't really hold levels, since it is so easy to cap. I was hoping that you were finding that to be the case on a 3x+ TR.

/sadtimes


First time 6 star runs on challenge quests got a guild mate of mine from level 18 to cap on his 3rd life. He didn't do any quests whatsoever after the vale. He was very meticulous about holding levels though. I'm not. Not because it doesn't work, but because I'm impatient to get to the next level and get more goodies.
  
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Re: Licoricewhip and tanking. Could use a hand here
Reply #15 - Jan 6th, 2012 at 3:18am
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stainer wrote on Jan 5th, 2012 at 9:26am:
@Madcow430

I gotta ask this -

I am working on my first 3rd life character, After level 6 I started holding levels. Your screen shot looks like you aren't holding lvls at all. Is that the case? How is that working out for you?

/multi tr noob


Holding levels is pointless nowadays.  Back when there was less to xp farm it was practically needed.  Nowadays? Fuck holding levels, it serves no purpose
  

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Re: Licoricewhip and tanking. Could use a hand here
Reply #16 - Jan 6th, 2012 at 2:46pm
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stainer wrote on Jan 5th, 2012 at 9:26am:
@Madcow430

I gotta ask this -

I am working on my first 3rd life character, After level 6 I started holding levels. Your screen shot looks like you aren't holding lvls at all. Is that the case? How is that working out for you?

/multi tr noob


Since the bravery bonus hit, I don't hold levels at all until levels 14-15.
  

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Re: Licoricewhip and tanking. Could use a hand here
Reply #17 - Jan 9th, 2012 at 7:22am
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Why is wisdom so low? 14 base +2 tome +2 ship +6 item = 24? Or did you only start with 8 and expect to have good AC? Wink

Icy Raiments: +4 Dodge
Chattering Ring (which you have): +3 Dodge
Goggles of Dodge (Cannith Crafted): +2 Dodge
Nimble Trinket: +1 Dodge
Do you have all of these?

If you used handwraps instead of Khopesh you'd have +1 AC as well, possibly a good idea when you need the AC, then you can be in Earth Stance too for 10% DR/+25% Hate or Water Stance for another +2 AC.
  
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Re: Licoricewhip and tanking. Could use a hand here
Reply #18 - Jan 9th, 2012 at 8:05am
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Wisdom is not a primary stat for this pally build.  I suppose I could have started with a base 10 or 12.  However upon considering the need to be able to have adequate to hit at cap, access to combat expertise/skill points, and the preference for two weapon fighting wisdom lost.  It was in fact an 8 base.  8 with a +2 tome, +6 item, +2 ship buff.  I will likely further address his wisdom if he pulls the right epic peices.  Yet there isn't really room via build points for wis investment.

He's currently using icy raiments/+8 bracers/etc...  I'll look into the cannith crafted +2 dodge.  Hadn't considered that, thanks Smiley

Trinket slot is currently occupied with a gfl item.  At cap it there will be a couple of items competing for that slot.

Primary handwrap use over khopeshes would require more monk levels I think.  I could be wrong here, but with a d6 base damage all of the additional bonuses for earth or water stance would not exceed the existing bonuses for the DOS pre.  Also the overall damage/threat would not be high enough to maintain aggro. 

For example, I did mired in kobolds elite yesterday morning.  There was a triple tr earth stanced pure monk that insisted on tanking the dragons.  He tried to steal aggro and could not.  I did not need to consider using intimidate at all.  This tells me I'm on the right track.  Just a little off center on the path so to speak.
  
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Re: Licoricewhip and tanking. Could use a hand here
Reply #19 - Jan 12th, 2012 at 5:15pm
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I guess her to hit gets nasty due to all those extra atks pushing up her to hit.
you are looking fine  for normal maybe hard raid tanking via ac. for elites an investment in wis will be needed imo.
  

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Re: Licoricewhip and tanking. Could use a hand here
Reply #20 - Jan 14th, 2012 at 5:04pm
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I think 65 is exactly the point where you are only getting hit on a 20 by Lailat, on normal.

Was pushing 80 to make an elite solo run work without resorting to Silver Flame pots.
  
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Re: Licoricewhip and tanking. Could use a hand here
Reply #21 - Jan 15th, 2012 at 3:29am
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rest wrote on Jan 5th, 2012 at 5:04pm:
First time 6 star runs on challenge quests got a guild mate of mine from level 18 to cap on his 3rd life. He didn't do any quests whatsoever after the vale. He was very meticulous about holding levels though. I'm not. Not because it doesn't work, but because I'm impatient to get to the next level and get more goodies.


i dont own the challenges pack.  after reading the wiki, i still have no idea how challenge xp works.

just how much xp is in the challenges pack?  is it from massive xp per run, or just grinding out a bunch of the challenges?
  

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Re: Licoricewhip and tanking. Could use a hand here
Reply #22 - Jan 15th, 2012 at 12:06pm
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green00_00 wrote on Jan 15th, 2012 at 3:29am:
i dont own the challenges pack.  after reading the wiki, i still have no idea how challenge xp works.

just how much xp is in the challenges pack?  is it from massive xp per run, or just grinding out a bunch of the challenges?



Note: numbers aren't correct, but the basic concept should be easy to grasp.


Each challenge has 5 stars you can earn by accomplishing different goals (and a 6th for a perfect run at highest available level).

The first time you earn a particular star it awards you some XP and a large % of every previous star you've earned that run.
The second time you earn a particular star it awards you some XP and a small bonus for each extra star.


So the basic idea to maximize your XP is to get 6 stars on the very first run so that the bonuses stack and you can wind up with 40k+ from a 5 minute quest for doing it perfectly.
You'll see the stars show up like optionals along these lines...
1* 2,500
2* 4,500
3* 8,500
4* 14,500
5* 22,500

If you've already earned all the stars, you're going to be seeing more around 9k for a perfect run.
You'll see something like these
1* 1,250 (repeat)
2* 1,500 (repeat)
3* 1,750 (repeat)
4* 2,000 (repeat)
5* 2,250 (repeat)

If you've earned only some of the stars previously, that's going to impact your total as well.
1* 1,250 (repeat)
2* 1,500 (repeat)
3* 1,750 (repeat)
4* 5,250
5* 10,250
  
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