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Mokune
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WF Evasive Melee Arti for PL
Mar 8th, 2012 at 10:01am
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Ok thinking something completely out of the box for me but seeing as how I've played the pew-pew helf arti already am considering a WF Melee Arti for Mokune's 5th life

PLs: Fighter, Monk, Cleric, Barbarian

+2 Tome all Stats, Gear to make any-thing work (for leveling) yada yada

Very little if any time spent at 20

For leveling I prefer Evasion, for Raiding/Epic I prefer Pure, For this life 2Rogue/18Arti 36 Pt,

24, Str 8: 10 => 16 +2 Tome, +6 Item 
16, Dex 8: 2 => 10 +2 Tome, +6 Item
26, Con 10: 8 => 16 +2 Tome, +6 Item, +2 WF Enh
34, Int 8: 16 => 18 +2 Tome, +6 Item, +3 Arti Enh, +5 Levels
14 Wis 6: 0 => 6 +2 Tome, +6 Item
14 Chr 6: 0 => 6 +2 Tome, +6 Item

1Rgu
2Arti
3Arti
4Rgu
5-20Arti

1,3,6,9,12,15,18 Std Feats (and order) Toughness, Pl Fighter, Insightful Reflex, Bastard Sword, Power Attack, IC Slash, LAST FEAT @ 18 ??? Augment Summon, THF, Toughness, Cleave, Mithril Fluidity ???
4, 8, 12, 16, Arti Feats Maximize, Mithril Body, Quicken, Empower
2 Rogue Evasion

Thoughts??
  

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Epoch
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Re: WF Evasive Melee Arti for PL
Reply #1 - Mar 8th, 2012 at 10:20am
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Take two monk instead.  Better saves and two feats.  Rogue nets you nothing besides evasion and 1d6 sneak attack dmg.  Over the monk levels it only nets you 1d6 sneak dmg.  Which you won't need.
« Last Edit: Mar 8th, 2012 at 10:21am by Epoch »  

OnePercenter wrote on May 15th, 2014 at 9:41am:
I just read that the cat followed up by visiting the dog house later that night, dropping some Willie Pete in on the sleeping dog.  #epochsfamiliarFTW

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Mokune
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Re: WF Evasive Melee Arti for PL
Reply #2 - Mar 8th, 2012 at 3:26pm
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Monk is a Solid Splash for this build as well, more Feats are always Tasty,

1d6 SA is meh

But on top of the Evasion, Rogue Nets 8xInt for Skill Points at lvl 1, and Haste Boost which was a lil more important to me for this build anyway.  Also allows for Hamstring as a Feat Consideration instead of PL:Ftr which I decided to drop.

I've been "Monk-ish" for 3 of the 4 PLs,  8mnk/12Ftr, 2Ftr/6Pal/12Monk, 2Ftr/2Monk/16 Cleric (currently 2Rogue/6Ranger/8of12Barb). I have a pure 2nd Life Shintao Monk that will be TRing after 6 more ToDs (comon +4 Str or Con PLZ!)

I have 3 more levels (holding 17) to nab so I have some time to work it all out.  If I can balance UMD Healing, GS Clickies, Madstone Procs and Barb Rages on my current life
I think I can make this next Arti life work...
  

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Diogenes
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Re: WF Evasive Melee Arti for PL
Reply #3 - Mar 14th, 2012 at 9:35am
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Has anyone here taken the "melee artificer" to cap?

It looks crappy to me, but I haven't tried it so I can't say I know.
  
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Blank
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Re: WF Evasive Melee Arti for PL
Reply #4 - Mar 14th, 2012 at 2:32pm
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Don't take mithril body.
  
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hgm-chi
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Re: WF Evasive Melee Arti for PL
Reply #5 - Mar 14th, 2012 at 5:28pm
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Quote:
Has anyone here taken the "melee artificer" to cap?

It looks crappy to me, but I haven't tried it so I can't say I know.


I tried to go with a TWFing melee arti when I was doing mine, based strictly on the fact that I had litII khopeshes to use.  At around level... 15?  I LR'd into a pure ranged int based arti.  It was just too painful, and I was constantly using xbows instead even without the feats to increase their damage.
  
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Re: WF Evasive Melee Arti for PL
Reply #6 - Mar 14th, 2012 at 5:54pm
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hgm-chi wrote on Mar 14th, 2012 at 5:28pm:
I tried to go with a TWFing melee arti when I was doing mine, based strictly on the fact that I had litII khopeshes to use.  At around level... 15?  I LR'd into a pure ranged int based arti.  It was just too painful, and I was constantly using xbows instead even without the feats to increase their damage.

This.  I splashed 6 arti on ranger this life to try out xbows and arti in general and even now with 12 ranger in the bag, when I expected to be full time TWF; the xbow is still better damage.
  
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Munkenmo
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Re: WF Evasive Melee Arti for PL
Reply #7 - Mar 14th, 2012 at 7:33pm
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Quote:
Has anyone here taken the "melee artificer" to cap?

It looks crappy to me, but I haven't tried it so I can't say I know.


i capped 2 arti's on lam during the 1k% exp.

bastard sword and rune arm hoping for glancing blows with 2hf - terrible idea, never doing it on live.

Did a monk 2, ranger 1 (wanted sprint boost and evasion) melee arti, did max int / wisdom, used the int to hit buff, and rarely failed stuns. the damage was low, but between blade barrier and a decent to hit the build seemed ok.

Not sure how it'd scale with bravery now and questing on elite, but if i were to do arti for a past life again, this would be how i go about it. (maybe giving up sprint boost for blade barrier at 17 vs 18.)
« Last Edit: Mar 14th, 2012 at 7:33pm by Munkenmo »  

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Re: WF Evasive Melee Arti for PL
Reply #8 - Mar 14th, 2012 at 7:54pm
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Thinking pretty hard about doing 8 arti/8 barb/4 figher (or monk if I really wanna blow a heart) for a barb PL. First eight levels pewpew arti, then switch to bastard sword + rune arm. Possibly awful but should be good fun.
  
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Maxwell Edison
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Re: WF Evasive Melee Arti for PL
Reply #9 - Mar 14th, 2012 at 7:56pm
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Possibly awful?  Also, won't 8art/8brb result in an artificer PL?
  

                                                                      
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Re: WF Evasive Melee Arti for PL
Reply #10 - Mar 14th, 2012 at 8:12pm
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Maxwell Edison wrote on Mar 14th, 2012 at 7:56pm:
Possibly awful?  Also, won't 8art/8brb result in an artificer PL?


For precedence the original classes are alphabetical, and then they added the new classes (monk, fvs, arti) on the end. An equal number of anything will beat an equal number of arti.
  
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Re: WF Evasive Melee Arti for PL
Reply #11 - Mar 14th, 2012 at 8:21pm
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I learned something today.


Don't much care for it tbqh.
  

                                                                      
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Re: WF Evasive Melee Arti for PL
Reply #12 - Mar 16th, 2012 at 6:00am
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I did a rant on the other forums about my experiences with my melee artificer, I'll copy paste for everyone:

Quote:
Points:
- Low level the extra spell slots from being able to scroll elemental weapons/ignore insightful damage let me be a much better party healer without sacrificing my personal DPS much (which isn't possible for pewpew). Also no contest between flame turret/insightful damage (as int isn't much higher than strength at that level). With Cannith Crafted gear the build was basically unkillable (95% fortification at level 3 iirc, life shield of invulnerability armour) and whether crossbow or bastard sword mobs died in 1-2 hits. There is very little difference between a bastard sword build using a crossbow from level 3 to 6 or so (point blank shot and rapid shot mainly).

- Lightning Cone rune arms work an absolute trick. I started with Chimera's Breath at level 3 eventually upgrading it with lightning lore and am now using Arcing Sky mostly. The cone shape of these rune arms hits everything within melee range including often mobs that are behind you in my experience. Buffing this up with maximum electric enhancements (only 1/1 in crit chance/damage though) and hitting electric motes has been a very effective nuke tactic in front of a flaming turret. I've used Pea Shooter/The Turmoil Within for backup as appropriate.

- Very buff/gear intensive. In the end I'm still a d6 HD, no evasion, bad saves build but by stacking available buffs (displacement scrolls, stoneskin scrolls, protection from elements, resist energy, +4 stat buffs from wands, haste pots, blur wand, protection from evil wand etc) and TR'ing with a decent amount of reasonably easily acquired raid gear (MinII belt - not ideal for this life but for next mainly, Minos, Levik's Bracers, Dance guard Fleshmakers Brigadine, PLIS, VPIS, Boots of the Innocent, Spectral Gloves, +6 int goggles/+6 con necklace, 2*Planar Girds and a good selection of bastard swords (Cannith crafted + Paralyzing icy bursted of pure good, vorpal icy bursted of pure good) I've had a good time of it. I'm sitting at close to 400 HP fully buffed at level 14 (though usually swap out Minos for Big Top for 100% heal scrolls with skill boost).

- Is the gear required? Not sure. I'm gauging myself against other TR'd characters like Blank_Zero's Warchanter Bard swinging a LitII Falchion and otherwise very well geared and very well played, the bar is set pretty high. I pugged a lot in the lower levels more for an audience and an elite opener than anything, I had quite a lot of good feedback but that would be gear/quest knowledge/aggressive play style as much as anything.

- Melee damage is lacking a little at level 14 but I'm getting GTHF at level 15 so am looking forward to more glancing blows which should help. I'm very much in a caster roll kiting large mobs (and not dying due to HP and other defenses) putting down a flame turret, charging rune arm, lightning motes and blasting the trash; usually only 1-2 mobs left after that to clean up with the sword. I did this to clean up all the trash in the final walk up elite DQ1 towards the first encounter with lailat. I was honestly a little worried if I could handle it but by the time my teammates caught up all the trash was basically dead.

- Even though I use a bastard sword crossbows are still an important part of the Artificer class. Beholders, some bosses, far away enemies all get the crossbow/endless fusillade treatment. AB isn't horrible with +6 dexterity bracers (tharnes), MGA crossbows slotted with +3 accuracy, GH, ship buffs etc but it's always a bit questionable whether to go with insightful damage or insightful strikes. Against elite DQ I went with insightful strikes and ended up with aggro despite a sharing the DPS job with the ranger (+4 holy MGA of evil outsider bane crossbow that i crafted just for the occasion did the trick). I no longer have any generalist crossbows; greater aberration bane loot gen, true chaos of construct bane MGA crafted and the above bow are all that I have. I'll farm the Doublecross xbow (which has int for attack so will be the highest DPS bow available to me most of the time with insightful damage on it) and silverflame crossbow (as I can't be bothered crafting a triple positive xbow).

- Rune arms and kiting don't mix. You lose movement speed when you're charging your rune arm and if there is a lot of trash you'll often lose shots to over crowding unless you swap to a short range rune arm (which doesn't function very well with ranged). If you want to maximise rune arm DPS you need to stand stock still and take whatever is coming at you but in that case why use a crossbow at all as you're losing most of the benefits, might as well build a sturdier toon capable of taking the hits (part of the theme).

Nothing else comes to mind, fair bit of work keeping track of buffs but overall the concept is working fine for me as a leveling build, I'm not sure if it will work at cap but I'm hoping that an Epic Chimera's Fang will help (and let me fit in greater spell focus: evocation for sick rune arm DPS).

Warforged is likely a better choice for the build premise but I wanted the cannith dragonmarks for crafting bonuses. There is a warforged version posted in the thread but it suffers from a very difficult choice: splash or having to choose between power attack and insightful reflexes. I'm a firm believer in staying pure to maximise rune arm and capstone DPS (you lose AB and damage if you splash so quickly end up doing less DPS even though you have the +5 damage from power attack without even factoring in lost levels on rune arm).

Worst thing about this build is limited inventory slots. I have about 10 inventory slots of loot at the moment and that is after getting rid of buff wands that I'd have preferred to keep and putting my Minos and some situational raid gear in the bank. I've hit that "Buy Now!" tab in my inventory more than once and thought about the 595 TP to get an extra page, damn turbine. If they had a sale I'd probably get it out of frustration.


I just leveled to 15 and spent some plat to swap greater dragonmark out to put maximise in to help blade barrier. Never felt the melee damage was lacking until level 14 (no GS mind you), I'm hoping taking GTHF'ing will help the melee damage again for the extra glancing blow in the cycle (which is quite significant as you get rune arm damage on it always).

Send me a message on here if you want me to post an update as I cap the character if anyone is interested.
  
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Epoch
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Re: WF Evasive Melee Arti for PL
Reply #13 - Mar 16th, 2012 at 8:09am
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I will sum up everything he said in one sentence:

"Artificers are new to me and I don't quite have the full grasp on them." 

  

OnePercenter wrote on May 15th, 2014 at 9:41am:
I just read that the cat followed up by visiting the dog house later that night, dropping some Willie Pete in on the sleeping dog.  #epochsfamiliarFTW

Sim-Sala-Bim wrote on Jan 27th, 2014 at 2:09am:
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Re: WF Evasive Melee Arti for PL
Reply #14 - Mar 16th, 2012 at 11:38am
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Thanks for crossposting that, wowo.

I definitely don't need an opener but I'll be pugging for the audience, heh. More and more temptation to splash monk.
  
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Re: WF Evasive Melee Arti for PL
Reply #15 - Mar 16th, 2012 at 12:17pm
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Munkenmo wrote on Mar 14th, 2012 at 7:33pm:
i capped 2 arti's on lam during the 1k% exp.

bastard sword and rune arm hoping for glancing blows with 2hf - terrible idea, never doing it on live.


Unfortuantely, I agree 100%.  There is obvious synergy there with glancing blows, but the synergy isn't enough to make up for the fact that it just blows fucking chunks as a build in general. 


  

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Re: WF Evasive Melee Arti for PL
Reply #16 - Mar 20th, 2012 at 5:04am
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popejubal wrote on Mar 16th, 2012 at 12:17pm:
Unfortuantely, I agree 100%.  There is obvious synergy there with glancing blows, but the synergy isn't enough to make up for the fact that it just blows fucking chunks as a build in general. 




Until you get blade barrier melee is very strong with a rune arm like chimera's breath/arcing sky as you can really maximise the rune arm DPS which really isn't possible on a ranged arti (due to the tendency to move/kite too much).

Warforged 2 monk/18 artificer would probably edge out the other melee options as evasion certainly helps when going toe-to-toe end game.

The melee build is still flexible enough to use ranged combat quite often. Today in elite/hard GoP I stuck with a crossbow and even without ship buffs I could use insightful damage. I've noticed that the Doublecross bow from Spinner of Shadows uses best of dex/int for AB so I'll pick one up asap and it can be my go-to bow for high AC foes.

Unfortunately there isn't much synergy between blade barrier and melee combat but that is true regardless of build (talking about the majority of divines here). In epic content I'm expecting the bastard sword/rune arm combo to shine again as blade barrier kiting becomes more situational rather than the be-all end-all.
  
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