Page Index Toggle Pages: [1] 2  Send TopicPrint
Normal Topic tough choice when it comes to a bard (Read 6250 times)
Grand
Ex Member
*


I Love Drama!

tough choice when it comes to a bard
Feb 17th, 2015 at 10:50pm
Print Post  
I have several end game bards these days, but really the only one I can play consistently is the Swashbuckler.

Please don't get me wrong, I really like the other trees as well and I think they are really fun.

The problem is that unless your a swash you not able to really kill quickly or efficiently.

Now this shouldn't be a problem, but it is. My most powerful bard is a maxed out spellsinger, and he is a fantastic toon with great gear and huge DC's, built to support teams and provide constant helpless targets for the dps machines to knock down. 

My Warchanter has great numbers, and can buff up a team as well.

The problem is that currently on Khyber there are just not that many LFM running and running a buffbard, or support bard stinks. Granted I can solo content, but it takes forever unless I'm running the Swash.

In Khyber eco-system these days a capped non-swash bard is parked for days at a time.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Starkjade
Completionist (i.t.p.)
******
Offline


Rogue Scholar

Posts: 7082
Location: Canadia
Joined: Aug 27th, 2013
Gender: Male
Re: tough choice when it comes to a bard
Reply #1 - Feb 17th, 2015 at 11:24pm
Print Post  
Is there a question in there?

If it was meant as an aside, the rest of us players are supposed to not hear it.
  

Two sips from the cup of human kindness and I'm shitfaced
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Hag Master
Ex Member
*


I Love Drama!

Re: tough choice when it comes to a bard
Reply #2 - Feb 17th, 2015 at 11:31pm
Print Post  
A Warchanter buffing bard I can understand, but why make a high DC bard? casters will always do it faster and better, so what's the point? 

Really the most valuable CC a bard has is not some lame version of hold, it's a upgraded version of Fascinate, but you really only need up to core III Spellsinger for that to get undead.

So I don't see the purpose.

  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Lehane
Waterworks Kobold
**
Offline


I Love Drama!

Posts: 116
Joined: Feb 4th, 2014
Re: tough choice when it comes to a bard
Reply #3 - Feb 17th, 2015 at 11:37pm
Print Post  
yeah gone are the days of healers only healing, Bards only buffing, and the other classes actually requiring those things. even barbs can sustain okay with minimal effort now.

best bet is to go swash with warchanter and minor spellsinger. I see a lot of people rocking the 14 bard, 4 fighter, 2 rogue. as a bonus this could be done with 2 of the iconics.

but your better off going with something that you can solo with and enjoy playing by yourself, that can also contribute to the group (you still have hage and songs and what not) instead of a buffbot that nobody really needs anymore and cannot solo.
« Last Edit: Feb 17th, 2015 at 11:37pm by Lehane »  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Lehane
Waterworks Kobold
**
Offline


I Love Drama!

Posts: 116
Joined: Feb 4th, 2014
Re: tough choice when it comes to a bard
Reply #4 - Feb 17th, 2015 at 11:41pm
Print Post  
btw can frozen fury allow you to proc coup de grace?
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Alex DeLarge
Epic Poster
*****
Offline


Get ready for some of
the 'ol in-out, in-out

Posts: 3460
Location: Foggy Albion
Joined: May 11th, 2013
Gender: Male
Re: tough choice when it comes to a bard
Reply #5 - Feb 18th, 2015 at 12:07am
Print Post  
Hag Master wrote on Feb 17th, 2015 at 11:31pm:
A Warchanter buffing bard I can understand, but why make a high DC bard? casters will always do it faster and better, so what's the point? 

Really the most valuable CC a bard has is not some lame version of hold, it's a upgraded version of Fascinate, but you really only need up to core III Spellsinger for that to get undead.

So I don't see the purpose.



I'm doing a high DC Spellsinger Bard. Why? Because I can.
It plays like a weaker sorc version atm Tongue, once I get the cap gear I'll see how good it actually is.
  

Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Wipe
VoD Slasher
*****
Offline



Posts: 1917
Joined: Mar 26th, 2012
Gender: Male
Re: tough choice when it comes to a bard
Reply #6 - Feb 18th, 2015 at 4:08am
Print Post  
Hag Master wrote on Feb 17th, 2015 at 11:31pm:
A Warchanter buffing bard I can understand, but why make a high DC bard? casters will always do it faster and better, so what's the point? 

Huh, bard "can" be a caster. Even with higher DCs.

Anyone with any sort of caster will eventually realize it's just faster and easier to jump on your Blitzing pally, bard or barb.
Or monkcher, still.
"At cap, doing fuck all" is a pretty common theme for a wizard.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Lehane
Waterworks Kobold
**
Offline


I Love Drama!

Posts: 116
Joined: Feb 4th, 2014
Re: tough choice when it comes to a bard
Reply #7 - Feb 18th, 2015 at 6:08am
Print Post  
Just TR'ed out of the swfwolfie into a Bard 12, Fighter 6, Rogue 2. so far (level 15) it is much more enjoyable. I know that the wolf does more damage and what not, but I just could not confined to wolf stance any longer.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Rubbinns
The Undeserving Fuckwit
*
Offline


I Love Drama!

Posts: 10460
Joined: Sep 4th, 2013
Re: tough choice when it comes to a bard
Reply #8 - Feb 18th, 2015 at 7:07am
Print Post  
Wipe wrote on Feb 18th, 2015 at 4:08am:
Anyone with any sort of caster will eventually realize it's just faster and easier to jump on your Blitzing pally, bard or barb.
Or monkcher, still.

unless your name is teth and you roll a 9sor 9wiz 2barb and still speed run in shiradi.

what was that? if youre reading this teth, was it for air savant and archmage lines?
  

Mockduck wrote on Aug 30th, 2010 at 2:20pm:
I don't think naming names would be a good thing for me to do, but I'd pretty much add anyone who's a know-it-all dick on the list.� Even if they are sometimes intelligent with their opinions, the way they state them in long, "i'm a lawyer at trial"-type posts makes me want to punch them in the face.� They act like whiney babies with god complexes and then freak out if someone so much as breathes criticism in their direction.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Wipe
VoD Slasher
*****
Offline



Posts: 1917
Joined: Mar 26th, 2012
Gender: Male
Re: tough choice when it comes to a bard
Reply #9 - Feb 18th, 2015 at 7:21am
Print Post  
If you mean that fishing for joy and mouse clicking Hellball, Energy burst and MM/FM/whatever missile is a caster play in this game, so be it.

I will pass. There is a lot of disdain against shiradi from many long time casters, for a reason.

But hey, it's an eternal topic.

Credit goes to Teth for original shiradi concept probably though.
« Last Edit: Feb 18th, 2015 at 8:23am by Wipe »  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Red Sox H8 Yankees
Stormreaver Piker
*
Offline


I Love Drama!

Posts: 708
Joined: Mar 20th, 2014
Re: tough choice when it comes to a bard
Reply #10 - Feb 18th, 2015 at 1:11pm
Print Post  
If this is meant to be a discussion on which Bard to build then OP is correct, Swash is king.  Sorry Singer and Chanter, how does it feel to be second fiddle?  Pun intended.
  

The grass is always greener on the other side of the razor wire fence.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
MadCookieQueen
Korthos Resident
*
Offline


I'm gonna sing the doom
song....

Posts: 56
Location: bottom of the martini glass
Joined: Jan 16th, 2015
Gender: Female
Re: tough choice when it comes to a bard
Reply #11 - Feb 18th, 2015 at 1:57pm
Print Post  
Red Sox H8 Yankees wrote on Feb 18th, 2015 at 1:11pm:
If this is meant to be a discussion on which Bard to build then OP is correct, Swash is king.  Sorry Singer and Chanter, how does it feel to be second fiddle?  Pun intended.


Well that was the devs decision and the only way to make a class playable was to give only one purely powered option and then let the rest fall off to the side.

Swash is the improved Easy Button...just add swashbuckling and you can make a reasonably effective toon out of duct tape, paper clips and a half elf.
  

Firestarter: 15 Bard/4 FvS/1 Fighter || War Dancer: 15 Bard/5 Ranger || Symphony of Metal: 15 Bard/3 Wizard/2 Fighter || Avatar of Eilistraee: 18 Bard/1 Cleric/1Fighter || Shadovar Infiltrator: 18 Wizard/1 Rogue/1 Fighter
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Red Sox H8 Yankees
Stormreaver Piker
*
Offline


I Love Drama!

Posts: 708
Joined: Mar 20th, 2014
Re: tough choice when it comes to a bard
Reply #12 - Feb 18th, 2015 at 6:52pm
Print Post  
MadCookieQueen wrote on Feb 18th, 2015 at 1:57pm:
Well that was the devs decision and the only way to make a class playable was to give only one purely powered option and then let the rest fall off to the side.

Swash is the improved Easy Button...just add swashbuckling and you can make a reasonably effective toon out of duct tape, paper clips and a half elf.

Prettymuch, kindasorta.  With Bard, the 3 trees are very different in what they offer beyond the basic core enhancements.  Barbarian blurred the line better but not by much.  Warchanter and Singer builds are very valuable too.  One of my guild mates plays a Bard/FTR/Rogue Swash that kicks ass "DPS wise" and can support with heals, traps and songs.
« Last Edit: Feb 18th, 2015 at 6:53pm by Red Sox H8 Yankees »  

The grass is always greener on the other side of the razor wire fence.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Lehane
Waterworks Kobold
**
Offline


I Love Drama!

Posts: 116
Joined: Feb 4th, 2014
Re: tough choice when it comes to a bard
Reply #13 - Feb 18th, 2015 at 7:27pm
Print Post  
fast Bard question, Warchanter tier 5's or Swash Tier 5's

running a PDK bard 12 bard 6 fighter 2 rogue, and I have the option to go icebreaker route (massive stun DC's) and use the various ice attacks to stun + the vanguard shield bash stun. the bonuse here is obviously lots of AoE through Cleaves and what not while still having great single target through some Swash. or full Swash having fewer stuns and AoE but much better single target?
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
gawker
Ex Member
*


I Love Drama!

Re: tough choice when it comes to a bard
Reply #14 - Feb 18th, 2015 at 7:54pm
Print Post  
MadCookieQueen wrote on Feb 18th, 2015 at 1:57pm:
BARK BARK! WOOF WOOF.




What's that girl? you want to be taken seriously so you're using talking points of other posters? Is that it girl? or is billy stuck in a well....


Fuck off, sell your tired, borrowed comments, so where else you stupid wannbe cunt.
« Last Edit: Feb 18th, 2015 at 7:56pm by gawker »  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Teth
Dragon Raider
***
Offline


I Love Drama!

Posts: 250
Joined: Jan 31st, 2014
Re: tough choice when it comes to a bard
Reply #15 - Feb 18th, 2015 at 10:04pm
Print Post  
Rubbinns wrote on Feb 18th, 2015 at 7:07am:
unless your name is teth and you roll a 9sor 9wiz 2barb and still speed run in shiradi.

what was that? if youre reading this teth, was it for air savant and archmage lines?


The 9/9/2 has lots of variability.  You can easily go air savant for more speed in longer quests/quests with good shortcuts requiring wings.  The other option is to go for arcane supremacy for better nuking/healing with death aura.

The build doesn't have very good mana efficiency as compared to my 12 fvs split with barb, but I just love death aura with the mrr/prr changes and sorc speed casting.  Not sure what I want to settle with, but I'm trying to find a good split so I can solo deathwyrm.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Teth
Dragon Raider
***
Offline


I Love Drama!

Posts: 250
Joined: Jan 31st, 2014
Re: tough choice when it comes to a bard
Reply #16 - Feb 18th, 2015 at 10:09pm
Print Post  
Wipe wrote on Feb 18th, 2015 at 7:21am:
If you mean that fishing for joy and mouse clicking Hellball, Energy burst and MM/FM/whatever missile is a caster play in this game, so be it.

I will pass. There is a lot of disdain against shiradi from many long time casters, for a reason.

But hey, it's an eternal topic.

Credit goes to Teth for original shiradi concept probably though.


Yea fishing for joy is gay for speed runs, but I do it just to show its the fastest possible time (faster times are ofc possible by better players/builds)).

But joy is not needed to cruise through ee content, the difference is just maybe a minute in time difference and that's about it.  I'm very bias though as I've been playing my caster for so long Smiley
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
MadCookieQueen
Korthos Resident
*
Offline


I'm gonna sing the doom
song....

Posts: 56
Location: bottom of the martini glass
Joined: Jan 16th, 2015
Gender: Female
Re: tough choice when it comes to a bard
Reply #17 - Feb 18th, 2015 at 10:42pm
Print Post  
gawker wrote on Feb 18th, 2015 at 7:54pm:
What's that girl? you want to be taken seriously so you're using talking points of other posters? Is that it girl? or is billy stuck in a well....


Fuck off, sell your tired, borrowed comments, so where else you stupid wannbe cunt.



awwwwwww...one of my stalkers has decided to follow me around the Vault....look how cute it is!

Does widdle stalker want a biscuit?
  

Firestarter: 15 Bard/4 FvS/1 Fighter || War Dancer: 15 Bard/5 Ranger || Symphony of Metal: 15 Bard/3 Wizard/2 Fighter || Avatar of Eilistraee: 18 Bard/1 Cleric/1Fighter || Shadovar Infiltrator: 18 Wizard/1 Rogue/1 Fighter
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Rubbinns
The Undeserving Fuckwit
*
Offline


I Love Drama!

Posts: 10460
Joined: Sep 4th, 2013
Re: tough choice when it comes to a bard
Reply #18 - Feb 18th, 2015 at 10:44pm
Print Post  
MadCookieQueen wrote on Feb 18th, 2015 at 10:42pm:
want a biscuit?

is it soggy?
  

Mockduck wrote on Aug 30th, 2010 at 2:20pm:
I don't think naming names would be a good thing for me to do, but I'd pretty much add anyone who's a know-it-all dick on the list.� Even if they are sometimes intelligent with their opinions, the way they state them in long, "i'm a lawyer at trial"-type posts makes me want to punch them in the face.� They act like whiney babies with god complexes and then freak out if someone so much as breathes criticism in their direction.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
5 Foot Step
Completionist (i.t.p.)
******
Offline


I Hate Idiots!

Posts: 11119
Location: USA
Joined: Mar 8th, 2014
Gender: Male
Re: tough choice when it comes to a bard
Reply #19 - Feb 18th, 2015 at 11:22pm
Print Post  
Teth wrote on Feb 18th, 2015 at 10:09pm:
Yea fishing for joy is gay for speed runs, but I do it just to show its the fastest possible time (faster times are ofc possible by better players/builds)).

But joy is not needed to cruise through ee content, the difference is just maybe a minute in time difference and that's about it.  I'm very bias though as I've been playing my caster for so long Smiley


So 2 barb for fast movement and sprint boost. Pale master for undead goodness. Sorcerer for MOAR magic missile!

Looks like you can do a full shiradi DPS cooldown rotation of just magic missiles. Wiz MM + Sorc MM + Archmage MM?  Shocked

Or does it go AM MM + Wiz MM + Sorc MM + Sorc SR + Wiz MM + Sorc MM?
  

Build links
Endgame Gear Guide
Cannith Crafting Planner link

Warning: May contain outdated cultural depictions.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
gawker
Ex Member
*


I Love Drama!

Re: tough choice when it comes to a bard
Reply #20 - Feb 18th, 2015 at 11:38pm
Print Post  
MadCookieQueen wrote on Feb 18th, 2015 at 10:42pm:
awwwwwww...one of my stalkers has decided to follow me around the Vault....look how cute it is!

Does widdle stalker want a biscuit?


Only someone as Stupid/unaware/narcissistic as you could see this as stalking dummy.

I'm just this weeks garbage man, putting you where you belong: on the curb.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Teth
Dragon Raider
***
Offline


I Love Drama!

Posts: 250
Joined: Jan 31st, 2014
Re: tough choice when it comes to a bard
Reply #21 - Feb 18th, 2015 at 11:53pm
Print Post  
5 Foot Step wrote on Feb 18th, 2015 at 11:22pm:
So 2 barb for fast movement and sprint boost. Pale master for undead goodness. Sorcerer for MOAR magic missile!

Looks like you can do a full shiradi DPS cooldown rotation of just magic missiles. Wiz MM + Sorc MM + Archmage MM?  Shocked

Or does it go AM MM + Wiz MM + Sorc MM + Sorc SR + Wiz MM + Sorc MM?


Wizard and sorc magic missle will share same cd, so basically am mm + sorc mm + sorc sr + past liferino + ruin
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
5 Foot Step
Completionist (i.t.p.)
******
Offline


I Hate Idiots!

Posts: 11119
Location: USA
Joined: Mar 8th, 2014
Gender: Male
Re: tough choice when it comes to a bard
Reply #22 - Feb 19th, 2015 at 12:16am
Print Post  
Teth wrote on Feb 18th, 2015 at 11:53pm:
Wizard and sorc magic missle will share same cd, so basically am mm + sorc mm + sorc sr + past liferino + ruin


Huh Is there a point to the wizard levels then when you can just go wf and reconstruct? On my sorc with 3 alacrity EPLs, MM+SR is almost a full rotation.
« Last Edit: Feb 19th, 2015 at 12:16am by 5 Foot Step »  

Build links
Endgame Gear Guide
Cannith Crafting Planner link

Warning: May contain outdated cultural depictions.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Teth
Dragon Raider
***
Offline


I Love Drama!

Posts: 250
Joined: Jan 31st, 2014
Re: tough choice when it comes to a bard
Reply #23 - Feb 19th, 2015 at 12:21am
Print Post  
5 Foot Step wrote on Feb 19th, 2015 at 12:16am:
Huh Is there a point to the wizard levels then when you can just go wf and reconstruct? On my sorc with 3 alacrity EPLs, MM+SR is almost a full rotation.


Undead immunities/ease of self heal.  Wasting time to recon is wasting time not dpsing Smiley

J/k, ofc this can easily be done with a sorc/fvs/barb.  I just like the wizzy sla's, and plus some quests don't require wings for speed running and supremacy adds a good amount of dps nuking.  Theres lots of possibilities and variation.  All up to the person playing.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
AtomicMew
Horoluth Raider
****
Offline


I Love Drama!

Posts: 2073
Joined: Jan 12th, 2011
Re: tough choice when it comes to a bard
Reply #24 - Feb 19th, 2015 at 2:00am
Print Post  
There's talk on the motherforums about the sorcerer/wizard split.  Barb splash is nice for speed runs, but I think wiz/sorc/fvs split is more reasonable for most people due to the insane SP efficiency.  12 sorc/6 wiz/2 FvS is easily the highest sustainable caster DPS.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: [1] 2 
Send TopicPrint