Wipe wrote on Dec 27^th, 2016 at 1:26pm:


Invis running should still work, as long as you are moving silently.  If you think your heavy armor build with 0 points in Move Silently can run at full speed through a dungeon and not attract any attention just because they are invisible, then I think you have been taking advantage of broken AI mechanics.

Like I said,  I think some shit needed fixed, but I think they created some unintended consequences that need to be corrected.  The change wasn't on Lama, afaik, and it seems like testing was limited.  They can do a better job of testing, imo.  They have lama and a PC.  But, just like your seatbelt, they can't save you from problems if you don't actually bother to use them. 

LagMonsterrrrrr wrote on Dec 27^th, 2016 at 2:02pm:


Really?

I didn't and I've run that quest twice at level since the change.

Maybe you're just not used to invis body pulling?

LagMonsterrrrrr wrote on Dec 27^th, 2016 at 5:06pm:


What would be the point in running Cursed Crypt on anything other than Elite exactly?

And I've made no bones over the years about the fact that I consider running anything less than Elite in Heroic to be a complete waste of my time!

The last time I ran anything on Casual?
Well that would probably be Dreaming Dark back when cap was 25 and I just wanted to farm a Pale Lav.

Instead of making baseless personal attacks you should perhaps learn how to body pull!
It can still be done - Even I've done it, not just once either but twice since the update! {Well actually 4 times as you have to do it twice per run}.

platfarmchink wrote on Dec 27^th, 2016 at 3:04pm:


OK, fair enough.  If you want to do invis running on a toon that is wearing medium or heavy armor with no investment in any skills or ED's or anything besides a basic invis spell, then you've been taking advantage of borked AI.  It was fun while it lasted.  Same as any other non-WAI feature.  Just because it has been so borked for so long that you forgot it was borked doesn't mean it isn't borked and you suddenly get to claim entitlement over it.

Honestly,  between monday night ( TS heroic Elite) and yesterday ( TS LE, Shroud LH, Hound LE )
I didn't notice much a difference... the AI is still fucked up in some case and the mob still aggro the rogue at the back that's not even attacking them, going through all the rest of the party to get at said rogue.

Even the little bit of ToEE that I did to waste some time the aggro wasn't hard... see a group, kill the group, go to next group, rinse and repeat.

platfarmchink wrote on Dec 27^th, 2016 at 10:59pm:


OK.  Let's try it this way:

There were things that were broken about AI and aggro.  You should not be able to range attack and kill a mob that is standing right next to other mobs without the other mobs activating/aggroing, for example.  Some things were working as intended.  You could use bluff on an idle mob that didn't have any aggro and they would aggro on you without sharing that aggro with any other mobs in their group, for example.

SSG implemented some changes to repair the broken AI (ranged attacks not aggroing other mobs).  The AI was broken to the player's advantage.  But they screwed up a bunch of stuff in making the changes, and as a result, now some other things are not working correctly (like the bluff I described above).  And the newly broken stuff is to the player's disadvantage. 

Now lots of players are frustrated.  Some are frustrated because SSG introduced errors and didn't do enough testing/QA.  These people understand what is non-WAI now and are trying to get SSG to address it. Some are frustrated because they want their easy buttons back and can't handle playing the game if it isn't spoon fed to them.  These people are generally trying to demand a roll back. 

Invis running fits in the easy button/crybaby category. 

EDIT:  Oh.  There is a 3rd group of players out there.  The people who are so clueless they don't know that anything is broken or don't want to admit it.  Example:
https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/482001-quot-New-quot-Aggro-Mechanic-Is...

Quote:


Ugh.  Overpraising the changes while downplaying the errors and lack of testing is not helpful.

Flav wrote on Dec 28^th, 2016 at 12:45am:


Ack, you joined too late Flav. TS heroic elite in a 4-man group was lots of fun

Asheras wrote on Dec 28^th, 2016 at 10:42am:


So now you're flip flopping after saying MS was used for invis running. Thats what we're getting at, not the rehashed diatribe you tried answering me with earlier which had nothing to do with invis.  Bury much DDOtalk71 pally?

DDONoob wrote on Dec 28^th, 2016 at 10:28am:


shhh, I didn't want to mention that by the time I joined you had shortmanned most of it with 4/5 persons. I wanted to let them have dreams of a full party. 

Vaultaccount wrote on Dec 28^th, 2016 at 2:26pm:


I'm not going to play these stupid "what if" games.  Does your armor squeak?  Maybe I oiled it!  And on and on.  Trying to apply physics or logic in a game rooted in magic and imagination is inherently flawed.  Everyone picks when they stop suspending disbelief at a different place.  There is no single foundation, so it is all arbitrary. 

Or we can argue about game mechanics and trade offs.  There needs to be a value to hide and MS and sneaking.  If every idiot with a 23 UMD or invis clickie (which is pretty much everyone, btw) can just use that and have 90% of the value, then a whole aspect of several classes and two skills are pointless.  Which makes the game homogeneous and and smaller.  It's the same problem with excessively accessible self healing and excessively accessible CC for the cost of 1 twist or 1 epic feat. 

But, none of that is going to matter if you want your easy button so you can invis run the quest in 3 min instead of 4 min.

I say leave the aggro, but add a Silence spell.

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/silence.htm

LagMonsterrrrrr wrote on Dec 27^th, 2016 at 7:19pm:


Yet more personal attacks to cover for your own ineptness I see.