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Is ToEE gear worth the grind? (Read 7338 times)

Skoodge LORD OF BOOBS Offline Whatever Posts: 3702 Location: Why? You want to visit me? Joined: Jul 19^th, 2014 Gender:	Is ToEE gear worth the grind? Sep 5^th, 2017 at 6:55am	Print Post
	Just curious. The weapons look decent, but are they really only good for the 7-12 range or are they good enough to carry you through TRing? Really quests don't get difficult until level 16 or so, so it seems like any grinding really wouldn't be worth it. What's got me mostly thinking about the pack is the bonus for equipping both armor and weapons. If I understand it right, you can end up with an extra 44 points towards melee power? Because on a barb, that would be a huge boost considering how much of their trees rely on MP. So how large of a level range is the heroic gear good for? And the same for the epic gear. How does the ToEE gear compare to other epic sets and what level range are they good for? How bad is the grinding to get fully upgraded sets? Thanks.

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Novalis Dragon Raider Offline I may be a bastard but I'm not a fuckin' bastard Posts: 234 Joined: Nov 19^th, 2015	Re: Is ToEE gear worth the grind? Reply #1 - Sep 5^th, 2017 at 7:23am	Print Post
	I found a mix of ToEE and slavers gear are excellent for early heroics. But if it's casual you'll spend more time farming what you need for a full set of gear that will last you 10 levels. If you're doing the 30 racial lives, then it would be time well spent. The epic versions however, although seemed more powerful, just doesn't cut it. The effort to get the upgrades is less rewarding than bashing your head into a wall til you lapse into a coma. The main issue is the DR bypass like the kind TF weapons have. ToEE will leave you hungry in the worst spots after you put in all that hard work for nothing.


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Alex DeLarge Epic Poster Offline Get ready for some of the 'ol in-out, in-out Posts: 3466 Location: Foggy Albion Joined: May 11^th, 2013 Gender:	Re: Is ToEE gear worth the grind? Reply #2 - Sep 5^th, 2017 at 8:13am	Print Post
	Skoodge wrote on Sep 5^th, 2017 at 6:55am: What's got me mostly thinking about the pack is the bonus for equipping both armor and weapons.� If I understand it right, you can end up with an extra 44 points towards melee power?� Because on a barb, that would be a huge boost considering how much of their trees rely on MP. I think there's no ToEE MP/RP set for heroic Armor+Weapon. Only for epics. And it's only slightly worth it for Full Retard MP TWF melees b/c you can slot the shitty ToEE weapon offhand. Also worth it for shuriken style toon with an offhand ToEE weapon + armor.


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Skoodge LORD OF BOOBS Offline Whatever Posts: 3702 Location: Why? You want to visit me? Joined: Jul 19^th, 2014 Gender:	Re: Is ToEE gear worth the grind? Reply #3 - Sep 5^th, 2017 at 9:27am	Print Post
	Novalis wrote on Sep 5^th, 2017 at 7:23am: But if it's casual you'll spend more time farming what you need for a full set of gear that will last you 10 levels. That's why I'm curious to what the level range is on them. Slavers was worth it for the trinket. It's good enough to use from level 8 straight through to TRing. But if ToEE gear takes days to grind and only shaves off minutes on quests I'm already shooting through, it's just not worth it. Alex DeLarge wrote on Sep 5^th, 2017 at 8:13am: I think there's no ToEE MP/RP set for heroic Armor+Weapon. I see that now, and it's not even +40 like I was thinking. The 40 is what a set would put me at right now. The base is only +20. Novalis wrote on Sep 5^th, 2017 at 7:23am: The main issue is the DR bypass like the kind TF weapons have. ToEE will leave you hungry in the worst spots after you put in all that hard work for nothing. I noticed that. Really wish they'd make metalline augments to make whatever new, shit weapons they expect us to craft useful. Games over a decade old and the devs are still clueless to what the rest of us know. Metalline is probably the biggest deal breaker when it comes to what weapons melees use.

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Rubbinns The Undeserving Fuckwit Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 10460 Joined: Sep 4^th, 2013	Re: Is ToEE gear worth the grind? Reply #4 - Sep 5^th, 2017 at 11:43am	Print Post
	Spinal Tap, the staff, great crossbow, the golden orb are all useful at ml7. For epics the light armor has no mdb.

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Asheras Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline This is why we can't have nice things. Posts: 10230 Location: Ohio Joined: Jun 9^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: Is ToEE gear worth the grind? Reply #5 - Sep 5^th, 2017 at 11:51am	Print Post
	ToEE crafting weapons are nice. But here is the problem: 1) No Vorpal. Vorpal is the meta for heroic leveling on melee and ranged. Anyone saying otherwise is a moron. Get a good vorpal weapon and go to town. 2) Until you get the purple slot on T2, You can't break DR for shit. No ghost touch means reapers kill you. No good means that you can't run Delera's 2-4. No Addy? Fun with constructs. I'd rather have a vorpal for trash (preferrably with a slot), a ghost touch weapon for reapers (preferrably an augment in the vorpal's slot) and then a boss beater (that can't be vorpaled and isn't incorpreal, which only a few are). The ToEE weapon is great for the boss beater part. But, honestly, bosses can't be champs and they are generally the least challenging part of most quests levels 7-11. And, no. They aren't better than Min II, Lit II, Rad II. So they die when Shroud gear appears, unless you don't have shroud gear. For these reasons, I actually like the following Named Items from ToEE more than the crafted ones: Assassins Kiss: Dagger - Incorp Bane, Purple Slot Leopard's Chill - Scimitar - Outsider Bane, Silver, Purple Slot Leverage - G-Xbow - Killer base damage, heartseeker, purple slot Spinal Tap - Bastard Sword - Hemoorageing, Puncturing, Wounding, Purple Slot Those slots make these great for DR breaking and damage dealing. Still, Shroud weaps (or other named items like Fatal Flaw, etc) are my go to in 12-14. ToEE armor - that's a different story. Fort +75% at level 7 is NICE. 1 level earlier than ML 8 augments. And, with PL's and/or an insightful bonus, is in the range of heavy fort. Dusk is ALWAYS cool. BUT...Slave Lords Executioner's Platemail is better at ML 8. Slot Heavy fort in the green slot and you have a better armor for any melee. Thus, the ToEE stuff is only really better for light armor and robes. Armor is generally good until ML 14, when the dragon armors show up. Then I switch to white, black, or blue. Build depending.


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WonderfulFoppyBint Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline Poooop Posts: 5947 Location: stockholm victim of hag master Joined: Oct 23^rd, 2013	Re: Is ToEE gear worth the grind? Reply #6 - Sep 5^th, 2017 at 12:15pm	Print Post
	For low skull mindless zerging I've gotten a lot of use out of the Elemental Bloom's paralyze and threat range. You can also ritual it and it stays BTA. Unfortunately, it breaks a lot. You can ritual any of the CC gear as well and they stay BTA. As the others are saying, Vorpal is the way to go for high skull stuff though.
	« Last Edit: Sep 5^th, 2017 at 12:15pm by WonderfulFoppyBint »
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noamineo Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline All men fear time, but time fears the pyramids Posts: 8850 Location: Titan Joined: Jul 2^nd, 2014	Re: Is ToEE gear worth the grind? Reply #7 - Sep 5^th, 2017 at 8:34pm	Print Post
	The main advantage ToEE/Slavers gear has over GreenSteel is that you CAN grind out the heroic versions by yourself while you've got some free time. Greensteel is still king after lvl 12, but if you don't have it, you aren't getting it soon.

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Asheras Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline This is why we can't have nice things. Posts: 10230 Location: Ohio Joined: Jun 9^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: Is ToEE gear worth the grind? Reply #8 - Sep 5^th, 2017 at 8:59pm	Print Post
	WonderfulFoppyBint wrote on Sep 5^th, 2017 at 12:15pm: For low skull mindless zerging I've gotten a lot of use out of the Elemental Bloom's paralyze and threat range. You can also ritual it and it stays BTA. Unfortunately, it breaks a lot. You can ritual any of the CC gear as well and they stay BTA. As the others are saying, Vorpal is the way to go for high skull stuff though. http://ddowiki.com/images/Elemental_Bloom.png Good call. I forgot about this item. I have two of them bouncing around. I just don't do a lot of staff builds. But paralyzing at ML 7 is pretty sweet.


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Ah Pook Puppy Farmer Offline Posts: 314159265 Posts: 1439 Joined: Mar 10^th, 2014	Re: Is ToEE gear worth the grind? Reply #9 - Sep 5^th, 2017 at 10:11pm	Print Post
	Anything that's BTA and gets a ritual stays BTA.

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iGouger Ex Member	Re: Is ToEE gear worth the grind? Reply #10 - Sep 6^th, 2017 at 12:53am	Print Post
	I've only used the ToEE items a handful of times in epics and they seem pretty good. I think I got them after a few weeks of hard work though, and I really don't think they are worth the grind. Epic in general is best done by running VoN3/Raiyum/Spies twice a day, which doesn't really necessitate great weapons anyway. And for those who want to stay at the cap, there are doubtless stronger weapons anyway, which probably require less grind. In heroics though, I really think the ToEE weapons are worth the grind. First of all, heroic ToEE is so much easier to grind than epic ToEE. Just go in with a capped character and roflstomp it and you'll get your requisite ingredients probably within a day or two. Easily something you can do over a weekend. For level 7 weapons, they're pretty amazing. The elemental AoE damage is fantastic for the level, and it's not till level 12 or so where monsters can even consistently reflex save for half damage. (And at that point, you're better off using GS anyway). On top of this, they get an augment slot, so you can slot in a Ruby Eye of element of your choosing or a Meteoric Ruby for even more AoE damage. I can't speak for the ranged or caster weapons though. Looking at them, I think they look pretty meh, but I could be wrong. All I can vouch for is the heroic melee ones, and they're really good from what I've seen. Definitely worth it.


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5 Foot Step Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline I Hate Idiots! Posts: 11119 Location: USA Joined: Mar 8^th, 2014 Gender:	Re: Is ToEE gear worth the grind? Reply #11 - Sep 6^th, 2017 at 11:22am	Print Post
	I've found that the craftable weapons are only useful if you're doing a niche build that doesn't have enough named weapon support. For example, I crafted a ToEE Gxbow and rode it all the way to 20 since Leverage wouldn't drop and Divine Artillery wasn't a thing yet. Debatable that it's still not "worth it." Greensteel does it better at 12, but is more of an investment.

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noamineo Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline All men fear time, but time fears the pyramids Posts: 8850 Location: Titan Joined: Jul 2^nd, 2014	Re: Is ToEE gear worth the grind? Reply #12 - Sep 6^th, 2017 at 1:48pm	Print Post
	Hmm, I did not realize the epic stuff was ML26(been laboring under the notion it was ML28). Since its good for a large chunk of epic life, might be worth revisiting.

	I'll never understand the propensity of people to brag about being good at a video game. Its a toy you play with for fun. The only person who should be proud of you is your mother. If you're 3.
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Asheras Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline This is why we can't have nice things. Posts: 10230 Location: Ohio Joined: Jun 9^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: Is ToEE gear worth the grind? Reply #13 - Sep 6^th, 2017 at 2:58pm	Print Post
	5 Foot Step wrote on Sep 6^th, 2017 at 11:22am: I've found that the craftable weapons are only useful if you're doing a niche build that doesn't have enough named weapon support. For example, I crafted a ToEE Gxbow and rode it all the way to 20 since Leverage wouldn't drop and Divine Artillery wasn't a thing yet. Debatable that it's still not "worth it." Greensteel does it better at 12, but is more of an investment. I'm a fan of Fatal Flaw at ML 14. http://ddowiki.com/page/Item:The_Fatal_Flaw It's not a GXB, its a heavy repeater, though. But the improved vorpal goes up to 1500 HP and does 150 damage. The Light Boltslinger at ML 15 does really nice damage though. http://ddowiki.com/page/Item:Light_Boltslinger Either of those that or Divine Artillery are great choices for upper heroics.


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Revaulting Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline Posts: 10143 Location: Not in my pants Joined: Apr 3^rd, 2014 Gender:	Re: Is ToEE gear worth the grind? Reply #14 - Sep 6^th, 2017 at 3:10pm	Print Post
	Heroic Zuggy can ROFLstomp some capped toons. Such an insane leap in power. Shoulda been an after-completion option, like Into The Deep.

	Silence is golden, but I only get silver rolls.
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5 Foot Step Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline I Hate Idiots! Posts: 11119 Location: USA Joined: Mar 8^th, 2014 Gender:	Re: Is ToEE gear worth the grind? Reply #15 - Sep 6^th, 2017 at 5:27pm	Print Post
	Revaulting wrote on Sep 6^th, 2017 at 3:10pm: Heroic Zuggy can ROFLstomp some capped toons. Who? I want to point and laugh.

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Digimonk Puppy Farmer Offline Posts: 1573 Joined: Apr 7^th, 2015	Re: Is ToEE gear worth the grind? Reply #16 - Sep 6^th, 2017 at 7:50pm	Print Post
	Revaulting wrote on Sep 6^th, 2017 at 3:10pm: Heroic Zuggy can ROFLstomp some handicapped players. Such an insane leap in power. Shoulda been an after-completion option, like Into The Deep.


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Frank Puppy Farmer Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 1429 Joined: Jan 14^th, 2016	Re: Is ToEE gear worth the grind? Reply #17 - Sep 6^th, 2017 at 11:55pm	Print Post
	Skoodge wrote on Sep 5^th, 2017 at 6:55am: Just curious.� In heroics? It depends. View the item vs. any random vorpal. Are you hunting for vorpals? Are you dependent on the item benefits? Make a call based on those answers.

	No, let me be Frank. Digimonk wrote on Dec 8^th, 2016 at 12:39pm: I've had multiple RoSS rot just from doing the explorer points in Sands across multiple lives since it is exclusive. Smart players know how to use buyback. Digimonk wrote on Dec 22^nd, 2016 at 1:58pm: I will not chone. I did what I did intentionally and while my primary purpose was not to annoy the other Vaulties, I acknowledge that it was a side effect. Smart people don't elicit "side effects."� They understand in advance the consequences of their actions.
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iGouger Ex Member	Re: Is ToEE gear worth the grind? Reply #18 - Sep 7^th, 2017 at 1:01am	Print Post
	Revaulting wrote on Sep 6^th, 2017 at 3:10pm: Heroic Zuggy can ROFLstomp some capped toons. Such an insane leap in power. Shoulda been an after-completion option, like Into The Deep. If you're talking about capped heroic, yeah. I don't see Zug taking down a typical level 30 person though. Whatever the case, I agree with the general sentiment you express, which is that its difficulty is way out of touch with the rest of the quest, which itself is out of touch with the rest of the level 7 material. IF I remember correctly, I remember Zugg being about as difficult as Yaulthoon is, and he's the boss to a level 15 quest.


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Metal-Beast Abbot Raider Offline \m/ Posts: 767 Joined: Apr 13^th, 2014	Re: Is ToEE gear worth the grind? Reply #19 - Sep 7^th, 2017 at 9:40am	Print Post
	Asheras wrote on Sep 5^th, 2017 at 11:51am: Assassins Kiss:� Dagger - Incorp Bane, Purple Slot Leopard's Chill - Scimitar - Outsider Bane, Silver, GOOD, Purple Slot Leverage - G-Xbow - Killer base damage, heartseeker, purple slot Spinal Tap - Bastard Sword - Hemoorageing, Puncturing, Wounding, Purple Slot FTFY http://ddowiki.com/page/Item:Leopard%27s_Chill
	« Last Edit: Sep 7^th, 2017 at 9:42am by Metal-Beast »
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Metal-Beast Abbot Raider Offline \m/ Posts: 767 Joined: Apr 13^th, 2014	Re: Is ToEE gear worth the grind? Reply #20 - Sep 7^th, 2017 at 10:08am	Print Post
	To the OP: The ToEE weapons rule supreme for levels 7-12. Nothing comes close. I slot a Ghostbane augment which seems to be the only real "Achilles Heel" at that level range. The AoE burst damage also scales with a weapons crit mod (maxes out at x4) so the better the mulitplier, the better your AoE gets. My TWF Dwarf Ranger with ToEE Heavy Picks was clearing entire rooms of trash well into Gianthold. A single 20 seems to proc both weapons together, so it strongly favours TWF. Of course, for THF at Lvl 10 you have Sword of Shadows and then at Lvl 12 there's Greensteel, which is still better than basically everything else across the board. For Reaper content, Vorpal/Disruption/Smiting are the new black. All things old are new again. I did make a ToEE GxBow, and had the Leverage, and found they were both "just OK". Not bad, not great. YMMV. I can't speak to the repeaters (since I never got one to drop), but at Lvl 6 you get the Scoundrel's Heavy Repeater which has a Red Slot for Ghostbane and higher base damage, and Acid (a great damage type). I rode that like a rented mule for 6-12 until I got Greensteel, and at 14 switched to Fatal Flaw. Now maybe I can switch to the (X) Boltslinger at 15 as well (probably light, which has Improved Vorpal). The ToEE arrmour is nice, but you can slot a Moderate Fort augment at Level 4 which kind of makes it moot, but the (X)element absorption, +2 Resistance and Dusk are nice if you don't have those things elsewhere. Like Asheras said, best for light armour or robes. FWIW: For Heavy Armour, the oft overlooked "No Worries" armour from the Birthday event has HILARIOUS armour value, green slot, insightful fort, and no skill check penalty. And you can get it at Lvl 5. Bonus: It's gold, black, and cool looking. http://ddowiki.com/page/Item:No_Worries For Epics, fuck it. ToEE is not worth the grief. You'll either level past it's usefulness, will have Thunderforged, or won't need it at all.

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noamineo Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline All men fear time, but time fears the pyramids Posts: 8850 Location: Titan Joined: Jul 2^nd, 2014	Re: Is ToEE gear worth the grind? Reply #21 - Sep 7^th, 2017 at 12:24pm	Print Post
	Metal-Beast wrote on Sep 7^th, 2017 at 10:08am: To the OP: FWIW: For Heavy Armour, the oft overlooked "No Worries" armour from the Birthday event has HILARIOUS armour value, green slot, insightful fort, and no skill check penalty. And you can get it at Lvl 5. Bonus: It's gold, black, and cool looking. http://ddowiki.com/page/Item:No_Worries Any word on when/if the event is coming back? I recall they reopened it for the 11th.

	I'll never understand the propensity of people to brag about being good at a video game. Its a toy you play with for fun. The only person who should be proud of you is your mother. If you're 3.
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5 Foot Step Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline I Hate Idiots! Posts: 11119 Location: USA Joined: Mar 8^th, 2014 Gender:	Re: Is ToEE gear worth the grind? Reply #22 - Sep 7^th, 2017 at 12:52pm	Print Post
	Nobody has legacy disjuncted Hero's Plate?

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ChewyOoeyGoOey Korthos Resident Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 85 Joined: Dec 13^th, 2013	Re: Is ToEE gear worth the grind? Reply #23 - Sep 7^th, 2017 at 1:50pm	Print Post
	5 Foot Step wrote on Sep 7^th, 2017 at 12:52pm: Nobody has legacy disjuncted Hero's Plate? Nevermind... You CANNOT use the Post U14/MotU random armors as I just tested it with stuff I bought from a vendor. Apparently, I have legacy armors that I can still use and craft on as they were previously BTC and now BTA (which is nice) since the CC update. My apologies!
	« Last Edit: Sep 9^th, 2017 at 12:15am by ChewyOoeyGoOey »

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Metal-Beast Abbot Raider Offline \m/ Posts: 767 Joined: Apr 13^th, 2014	Re: Is ToEE gear worth the grind? Reply #24 - Sep 7^th, 2017 at 2:57pm	Print Post
	5 Foot Step wrote on Sep 7^th, 2017 at 12:52pm: Nobody has legacy disjuncted Hero's Plate? I have both Hero's Plate and the Hero's Breastplate. I found they were OK "Out of the box" but quickly lost their lustre. By Lvl 5 No Worries buried anything at level and most things you could craft (I'm not a good crafter so my opinion is unquaified in this regard). Quote: Any word on when/if the event is coming back? I recall they reopened it for the 11th. I hope so... I'd like to make some additional Kookie Kutters, another great but over-looked item (Your Druid and Bard will love it) http://ddowiki.com/page/Item:Kookie_Kutter
	« Last Edit: Sep 7^th, 2017 at 3:03pm by Metal-Beast »
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