What's wrong with a self-healing Epic-specced caster? WF Archmage, or Drow PM is what I usually see over on Khyber at endgame.

Casters are pretty easy (relatively) to set up for a hold-bot (you can do a lot lot more than just mass hold but you'll get that with time)

Warforged archmages are probably easier for the novice caster with little to no gear. Drow palemasters get stronger and stronger with better gear and in my mind are a superior choice once fully equipped.

Really the easiest way to get an epic focused caster up to speed is TR's. do as many wiz lives as you can handle. They will all be beneficial.

With that very basic info let me know what ur thinking and we can go from there. Playing a great epic caster revolves around 2 things. 1. getting ur DC's to a high enough point (pretty easy) and 2. a very aggresive playstyle.

Dont go dwarf theres absolutely no bonuses to it apart from being a very fat palemaster...

N

I think the more aggressive playstyle will be the harder of the two to handle, simply because I've only recently started to play aggressively on my cleric. It's a lot of fun actually.

If the best way to do things is to TR, then I will TR multiple times. I've got time, with the hubby deployed, and me working from home soonish.

What sort of gear do you mean for a drow palemaster?

Nick_robinsonchia wrote on Jan 30^th, 2011 at 6:56pm:

Nick_robinsonchia wrote on Jan 30^th, 2011 at 7:08pm:

PM owns AM IMO for that very reason. A good caster zergs and zergs hard dominating everything it passes. If youre having to focus on reconstructing your fucking self then you aren't dominating them.

Half-elf would be a better start hp wise if you are concerned kannya.  Unless you already have the gear the half elf will obtain the same DC, maybe -1 during some levels. 

Then again, this is only if you are concerned about it and want more leeway before taking the HP hit.

Ok, so I have 4 TRs to do if I swing it with my ranger, and 3 if I start a wiz and run it fast to cap. Fuck the ranger, I can find something else to do with that toon.

Ok, crunching stuff in the planner.

Epoch, I am worried about HPs either way. I tried a drow in the planner and was very scared lol.

should be around 550hp on a drow pm all geared out kanny. thats what il be shooting for on bigg.

N

Felgor wrote on Jan 30^th, 2011 at 7:36pm:


Yeah you dont really but if she wants to be MORE effective its the easiest way to get big boosts.

Why not zerg 3 lives?  Takes what, 2 months if kannya gets lazy about it? 3 weeks if not? Really would not be that far behind in a timeline of raid gear anyways.

Im gonna post this then im out for the night so il check back in in a few days.

N

Hey man,

Reasons why I went drow PM over WF AM.

OK where to start. Since you mentioned survivability we can start with defensive measures first. Let me say that I dont think one or the other is more survivable from a 'will I die' Point of View. They should both be near unkillable in the proper hands. The difference in my mind is that the Palemaster requires next to no maintenance of his hp bar except for spike/burst damage w/ death aura up. Less time reconstructing means more time pwning shit. Let me throw out what the drow palemaster has going for it from a defensive standpoint. Its the combination of all of the below that makes them so defensively strong - an AM get some of them but not all. Its the same premise as sp regen items - go big or go home.

1. High Hp - you should be around 550hp geared/buffed out..on a drow.

20 Base
80 Wizzy
20 Tough item
22 Toughness feat
20 Tough enh
20 Palemaster III
260 Con (16 base +2 tome + 7 cloak +1 exc + 2 rage + 4 lich +2 yugo + 2 boat = 36) 38 with litany and +3 tome.
45 shroud
10 AoA
20 hidden yugo
30 GFL

= 547

2. Amazing reflex save - due to insightful reflexes. Spike damage is the only thing that should kill an arcane and any wizard has this over a sorc but its the combination of this with with the hp and the temporary hp set up and the death aura tick that makes this so nice. Between this feat hotswaps for absorbtion items resists and fire/cold shield you take very little to know elemental damage anymore when the you know the damage will be extreme.

3. Temporary hp - This has more to do with availability of gear than anything else. But is a very strong option.

1. Lich form - temporary hp on hit
2. Mabar/shroud of the abbot - boon to undeath (heal on hit)
3. DQ bracers - temp hp (think 20% proc rate for 30hp) neg levels do not hit undead which takes away the big downside of the bracers. WF archmages will get the negs.
4. Conc op - temp hp

4. Aura Healing - Combine all of the above with average 35/tick 'healing' (critting for 70 at times) and i barely ever have to use the 'insta-heal' burst. There are many many epics where i dont even use the burst. I use maybe 3 typically in DQ2 while im kiting the the efreet/gnolls and nuking the queen. I typically solo 3rd base in velah and maybe use one if i need to.

5. Negative energy burst. - A weaker reco that uses more sp. I try not to use this as much as possible and just let my aura tick me to full but its there when I need it.

6. Wraith form and incorporeal - not to be underestimated and is something alot of PM dont bother with. I use this ability alot. Playstyle is slightly different on a PM to a sorc. Turtling basically never happens - you are much better served jinking in tight circles blasting away with ur 'free' nukes than turtling if the melees need to peel agro off you. Part 2 tower when kiting, dq2 when kitting trash and blasting - any time where defensive measures > offensive is when you use wraith form. Permanent cloud concealment without casting the cloud is just gold.

7. Mana regenning. This is one of the only times i will shield block anymore. Mana regen is far more efficent on a PM than a warforged arcane. Temorary hp + aura means theres not need to cast healing spells while ur getting beat up on. Those spell points u receive from conc op and torc are just that - free.

The defensive measures are so strong I barely use SP other than aura to take care of myself which is key when comparing wf arcane to PM from converting defense to offense. I dont know typically how many sp I would use casting quickened reconstructs on myself as a wf. As a PM...1-3 most quests if that.

Offensively (Il deal with the less obvious first)

1. Free Nukes!!! I dont know why I dont see many Palemasters taking advantage of these. Everytime im not casting cc im blasting away with these. Im talking about the level 6/12/18 prestige blasts that use HP instead of sp to cast. As long as you have enough juice to cast a death aura you can spam these all day long. Critting for 300's with next to nothing saving on them (its a fort save so all the evasion types trash gets hit too) due to the uber necromancy DC you have its a continual source of albeit light dps. These free nukes is why I will not build battlemages anymore. In my mind I always built melee capable arcanes because I felt I was not doing as much as I could when conserving sp - may as well melee and pump out more dps for no sp. Now i can just blast away and do about as much as I would meleeing if not more while not making any sacrifices in feats or stat points to make sure I was an effective weak melee.

2. Necrotic Ray - the lvl 6 spell - is my go to single target damage spell. There was a stealth boost to this spell some time ago. Basically it functions like disintergrate but the floor of the damage is alot higher and is boosted by ur prestige line. So even when they save its still 300+ points of damage max and emp. And next to nothing saves against a 45+ DC lol.

3. Dark Monks - I know you love ur dark monks...and so am I now after playing one this life and also a pale master. When ur high wisdom dark monk lands there D-D-D finisher it not only pumps their own ToD but it pumps up ur free nukes and ur necrotic ray. This doesnt happen in every group you run but when you get a good dark monk in ur group seeing purple damage from free stuff is great

4. Spell dc's.

This was one of the main points of why I went palemaster over Archmage initially. All things being equal comparing a drow palemaster too an archamage you get

Drow + 2 int over warforged
Lich +2 int over Archmage
Yugo pots - +2 int over Archmage (without beign crit ever - saying this i do know alot of AM that use these anyway)

Archmage +2 in one school over Palemaster.
+1 in secondary school if taken.

Now given that both prestiges take gsf:enchantment its close to a wash and ur 2 higher in every other school. I use flesh to stone alot. I use web alot. I blast alot. ( I have 2 sorc pl so my evocation saves are crazy high). Its limiting to say that enchantment is the only school that matters - its the most important but its not the be all and end all. Basically you have similar ench dcs and better in every other school. Personally I run around without GSF Ench as I just dont need it any higher. And while AM have next to free blasting it still costs sp and that stuff really adds up fast. You cant really compare Pale master free nukes to archmage free nukes. Yes there stuff works on undead and deathwarded types. But against undead you need not look past firewall/inced cloud. Save Raiyum but thats what the melees are along for.

5. Enhancement Cost

Archmage is heavier AP wise than PM if you want to do it right. I spec for both fire/cold and elec acid as a pm. most archmages can just do fire/cold and a some in repair/force. I dont even carry recon on my caster anymore. With Half-Orcs/elves taking up the most melee slots these days(with who i run with anyway) Its not necesary for me to carry it full time. As a Palemaster you dont have the capstone dmg of a sorc (which isnt 20% its more like 8% due to stacking) but my nukes consistently are not saved against. The nuking disparity against raid bosses is not as much as some might think due to raid boss save failure.

6. Non epics - Wail DC trivialises all content non epic on a palemaster. They give us end game that actually isnt riddled with blanket immunities this will be important. Walking through amrath elite wailing everything is just fun.

I think that covers alot of the inherent differences. I will say this tho - archmages are certainly more noob friendly as they dont need alot of the gear that makes a palemaster really shine . All the temporary hp's are key to making a mana efficient PM.

My guys 32p(36p) Drow just max con and int. I had problems having 9 str at low levels. Wear a str item while ur leveling. Ray of enfeeblement and carrying capacity is a pain in the ass. Eat a +2 tome and slot +6 str somewhere by cap. Leveling up you will feel weaker than a wf until you hit level 12. Then its god mode from there on out. Initially ul have to get used to group deathward tactics - let people know when you've gone into a form. Do it often until ur regular group of friends know what to expect. You dont want to recast it and waste 100sp every time.

My feats were (in no particular order)

1. Max
5. Emp
10. Quicken
15. Heighten
20. Extend

1. insightful reflexes
3. Tough
6. Mental tough (for wraith form)
9. Wiz Pl
12. Necro
15. Gr Necro
18. Enchantment

Note i have taken no spell pen feats as i have a wizzy and fvs past life. Wiz past lives are prob ur fastest path to power as it frees up feats and enhancements used for spell pen. I occasionally miss some spell pen checks but not enough to bother me. I plan on another 2 wiz lives when im done with groan so this will remedy it.

You could swap extend or empower for gr sf: ench but honestly i wouldnt bother - I dont really fail with a 42-43 dc enchantment.



H - Elders cap (ench and conc off a weapon)
N - torc/noxious
T - Litany/eardweller
Cl - Envenomed
Be -Archamge/Palemaster set take ur pick
Bo - shroud sp
br - epic dq
R1 -archamge/PM set w/ int
R2 -Shamans band (spell pen 9) - this is my hotswap. Ring of djinn, tras tod with inherent resists and importantly ring of the mire.
Gl -Still pretty free but im currently wearing gloves of glacier - also a hotswap item.
gog -Shroud HP
Bod -Currently wearing diabolist but will switch to mabar robes when i get them and a litany to balance my int out.

Oh yeah that reminds me - regalia of the phoenix and wizzy casting time makes meteor swarm plain awesome. Meteor swarm is still bugged Im 99% sure. A jumping wizard without quicken on gets more meteors than a sorc or a wiz with quicken on. you can get the full 4 getting ur timing and jumping right. As a fleshy you get the bonuses of the regalia of the phoenix to pump ur meteor swarm. Once you get ur timing right and using the regalia/eardweller meteor swarm is ur best dps spell handsdown. A spell often overlooked by sorcs and warforged (who only get epic tinder to boost theirs..)


N

Leira wrote on Jan 31^st, 2011 at 2:56pm:


Honestly it was a personal choice I wanted to have a clear comparison to a wf archmage. That and drow maxed int puts you at uneven therefore I can wear the mabar robe instead of needing to wear the diabolist to keep me at even int not mattering what I have in my hands. Either are fine options.

Nick_robinsonchia wrote on Jan 30^th, 2011 at 7:13pm:

Ya I don't run insightful reflexes or DQ bracers and barely have to burst heal. If I forget fire shield or get a chain lightning with prot not refreshes are the only times really.