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Nerfs are going ahead as planned (Read 6586 times)

[] Madame President Offline Posts: 10532 Joined: Oct 16^th, 2015	Nerfs are going ahead as planned Oct 20^th, 2015 at 6:16pm	Print Post
	<DDOChatter_25>: varg: any chance you guyswill just call off all proposed changes to the game and leave it alone? <Vargouille>: I do not expect us to do zero of the proposed changes. That is ... very unlikely. I tried to get them to leave the game alone; request denied.
	« Last Edit: Oct 20^th, 2015 at 6:16pm by [] »

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Asheras Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline This is why we can't have nice things. Posts: 10230 Location: Ohio Joined: Jun 9^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: Nerfs are going ahead as planned Reply #1 - Oct 20^th, 2015 at 7:23pm	Print Post
	Some of the changes make sense. Doubleshot not applying properly to repeaters. IC multiplying ED/Enhancements/Spells. Updating classification of Crit bonuses on Barb Ravager and LD Pulverizer. New fighter feats. Some of them are nerfs that should not happen: Not giving named weapons proper Crit ranges. Holy Sword. Manyshot. 10k Stars. PRR/MRR changes. Warlock nerfs. Luckily, they backed down on the Holy Sword stuff and the named weapon crit ranges. And Wish we could get some movement on PRR/MRR and Manyshot/10k Stars and Warlocks.


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Tangelina Waterworks Kobold Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 142 Joined: Oct 9^th, 2014	Re: Nerfs are going ahead as planned Reply #2 - Oct 20^th, 2015 at 7:34pm	Print Post
	[] wrote on Oct 20^th, 2015 at 6:16pm: I tried to get them to leave the game alone; request denied. You used the wrong approach, you should've think "what would Uurlock would've done to appease the devs?" instead you went all gung-ho with em


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Rubbinns The Undeserving Fuckwit Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 10460 Joined: Sep 4^th, 2013	Re: Nerfs are going ahead as planned Reply #3 - Oct 20^th, 2015 at 7:37pm	Print Post
	Tangelina wrote on Oct 20^th, 2015 at 7:34pm: what would Uurlock would've done to appease the devs? suck turbine dicks?

	Mockduck wrote on Aug 30^th, 2010 at 2:20pm: I don't think naming names would be a good thing for me to do, but I'd pretty much add anyone who's a know-it-all dick on the list.� Even if they are sometimes intelligent with their opinions, the way they state them in long, "i'm a lawyer at trial"-type posts makes me want to punch them in the face.� They act like whiney babies with god complexes and then freak out if someone so much as breathes criticism in their direction.
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Vendui Releaser Of Exploits Offline Dare to tempt your fates? Everything has a price. Posts: 2492 Location: Central WI Joined: Oct 31^st, 2013 Gender:	Re: Nerfs are going ahead as planned Reply #4 - Oct 20^th, 2015 at 8:29pm	Print Post
	Asheras wrote on Oct 20^th, 2015 at 7:23pm: Manyshot.� 10k Stars. Please, Tell me how this is a nerf as you say? (Asside from less procs. that is the only thing affected by the change) ~Insert a bunch of math at a later time, im hungy first~


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[] Madame President Offline Posts: 10532 Joined: Oct 16^th, 2015	Re: Nerfs are going ahead as planned Reply #5 - Oct 20^th, 2015 at 8:33pm	Print Post
	you're a tool vendul; no on is going to bother educating you.


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Asheras Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline This is why we can't have nice things. Posts: 10230 Location: Ohio Joined: Jun 9^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: Nerfs are going ahead as planned Reply #6 - Oct 20^th, 2015 at 10:49pm	Print Post
	Vendui wrote on Oct 20^th, 2015 at 8:29pm: Please, Tell me how this is a nerf as you say? (Asside from less procs. that is the only thing affected by the change) ~Insert a bunch of math at a later time, im hungy first~ I agree that the changes will result in more base weapon damage due to the combination of double shot and RP over the 120 second cycle, assuming you make even a moderate investment in double shot. But the fact remains that the number of missiles fired is significantly reduced. Approximately 20%. Or more. Depending on your double shot. Losing that many arrows resume in a lot of lost procs. It's more than the base weapon damage alone in several cases. Especially when players were combining other, limited duration helpless/paralyzed features and or IPS with many shot to get even more DPS. I get that the devs don't want to support that play style. They've come out and said they know they are negatively impacting it and that was a design goal. Which is fine. It's their game and they choose what play styles they want to be viable. But that also, by definition, makes it a nerf to those builds.


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Vendui Releaser Of Exploits Offline Dare to tempt your fates? Everything has a price. Posts: 2492 Location: Central WI Joined: Oct 31^st, 2013 Gender:	Re: Nerfs are going ahead as planned Reply #7 - Oct 20^th, 2015 at 11:36pm	Print Post
	Asheras wrote on Oct 20^th, 2015 at 10:49pm: I agree that the changes will result in more base weapon damage due to the combination of double shot and RP over the 120 second cycle, assuming you make even a moderate investment in double shot.� � But the fact remains that the number of missiles fired is significantly reduced.� Approximately 20%.� �Or more.� Depending on your double shot.� Losing that many arrows resume in a lot of lost procs.� �It's more than the base weapon damage alone in several cases.� �Especially when players were combining other, limited duration helpless/paralyzed features� and or IPS with many shot to get even more DPS. I get that the devs don't want to support that play style.� They've come out and said they know they are negatively impacting it and that was a design goal.� Which is fine.� It's their game and they choose what play styles they want to be viable.� But that also, by definition, makes it a nerf to those builds.� Aye, the dmg per shot is relatively the same over all, and in cases of more than 20% doubleshot you are doing more dmg per shot than before, minus the added proc chances. You mention the helpless/paralyzed feature, which is a good thing to look at. 4 arrows, at say 200 dmg each? (im sure its more than this considering my shurikens are doing 210-250 atm and they are 1d2, not 1d8/10/12) 200 * the 30% helpless dmg (sense weakness) is 260 dmg per arrow base * 4 comes to 1040 un-modified dmg. now factor 2 arrows with 96% additional DMG from RP, 392 dmg per shot * 30% * 2 - 1019 dmg. is it a loss of dmg, yes.. Is it enough to cry and throw a tantrum, not really.. Everyone with a brain already knew that such tactics as the Slayer Arrow + Manyshot + Fury were overperforming, by a lot. It should come to no surprise that it got tweaked down. Be lucky they did not change fury to only work with melee like they had planned to a year ago.
	« Last Edit: Oct 20^th, 2015 at 11:38pm by Vendui »

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Rubbinns The Undeserving Fuckwit Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 10460 Joined: Sep 4^th, 2013	Re: Nerfs are going ahead as planned Reply #8 - Oct 21^st, 2015 at 12:00am	Print Post
	Vendui wrote on Oct 20^th, 2015 at 11:36pm: Everyone with a brain already knew that such tactics as the Slayer Arrow + Manyshot + Fury were overperforming, by a lot. It should come to no surprise that it got tweaked down. No. Any mech using blitz already beat any record a monkcher held. It's just nerfing to nerf at this point. I guess it makes the bitches on the mobos feel better somehow?

	Mockduck wrote on Aug 30^th, 2010 at 2:20pm: I don't think naming names would be a good thing for me to do, but I'd pretty much add anyone who's a know-it-all dick on the list.� Even if they are sometimes intelligent with their opinions, the way they state them in long, "i'm a lawyer at trial"-type posts makes me want to punch them in the face.� They act like whiney babies with god complexes and then freak out if someone so much as breathes criticism in their direction.
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Vendui Releaser Of Exploits Offline Dare to tempt your fates? Everything has a price. Posts: 2492 Location: Central WI Joined: Oct 31^st, 2013 Gender:	Re: Nerfs are going ahead as planned Reply #9 - Oct 21^st, 2015 at 12:23am	Print Post
	Rubbinns wrote on Oct 21^st, 2015 at 12:00am: No. Any mech using blitz already beat any record a monkcher held. It's just nerfing to nerf at this point. I guess it makes the bitches on the mobos feel better somehow? But even that wasnt WAI, and you know it >.> Full DS on each bolt, rather than 1/3 DS on each bolt as it should have been..


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Rubbinns The Undeserving Fuckwit Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 10460 Joined: Sep 4^th, 2013	Re: Nerfs are going ahead as planned Reply #10 - Oct 21^st, 2015 at 9:35am	Print Post
	Vendui wrote on Oct 21^st, 2015 at 12:23am: But even that wasnt WAI, and you know it >.> Full DS on each bolt, rather than 1/3 DS on each bolt as it should have been.. Great xbow was not that far behind in quick bruntsmash run conducted this morning. >human 14p/5r/1ar >46int >divine favor >62 ranged power >holy sword >harper enchant weapons >arty enchant weapons spell >30 doubleshot(no DS epic lives) >in DC running epic moment, human with haste boost/damage boost/KtA/blinding speed feat >backstabbers/MoD quiver/epic litany/dragon masque/10 seeker 5 exceptional > 3 monk lives Light TF mortal fear no red augment took 25 seconds Epic divine artillery mythic +2 no red augment took 34 seconds
	« Last Edit: Oct 21^st, 2015 at 9:40am by Rubbinns »
	Mockduck wrote on Aug 30^th, 2010 at 2:20pm: I don't think naming names would be a good thing for me to do, but I'd pretty much add anyone who's a know-it-all dick on the list.� Even if they are sometimes intelligent with their opinions, the way they state them in long, "i'm a lawyer at trial"-type posts makes me want to punch them in the face.� They act like whiney babies with god complexes and then freak out if someone so much as breathes criticism in their direction.
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Asheras Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline This is why we can't have nice things. Posts: 10230 Location: Ohio Joined: Jun 9^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: Nerfs are going ahead as planned Reply #11 - Oct 21^st, 2015 at 10:18am	Print Post
	Vendui wrote on Oct 20^th, 2015 at 11:36pm: Aye, the dmg per shot is relatively the same over all, and in cases of more than 20% doubleshot you are doing more dmg per shot than before, minus the added proc chances. You mention the helpless/paralyzed feature, which is a good thing to look at. 4 arrows, at say 200 dmg each? (im sure its more than this considering my shurikens are doing 210-250 atm and they are 1d2, not 1d8/10/12) 200 * the 30% helpless dmg (sense weakness) is 260 dmg per arrow base * 4 comes to 1040 un-modified dmg. now factor 2 arrows with 96% additional DMG from RP, 392 dmg per shot * 30% * 2 - 1019 dmg. is it a loss of dmg, yes.. Is it enough to cry and throw a tantrum, not really.. Everyone with a brain already knew that such tactics as the Slayer Arrow + Manyshot + Fury were overperforming, by a lot. It should come to no surprise that it got tweaked down. Be lucky they did not change fury to only work with melee like they had planned to a year ago. There is a difference between an over performing build and a non-WAI build. The players invest a lot of time to find the efficiencies and sweet spot combos of features and classes. This results in fotm and over performing builds. If turbine follows the players and nerfs optimal designs the players come up with, it provides a disincentive to players enjoyment and efforts. They need to fix broken features that are being taken advantage of. But be careful about chasing away the build optimizer crowd.


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ILoveExploits Horoluth Raider Offline I Love Exploits! Posts: 2157 Location: piking @ work Joined: Oct 31^st, 2013 Gender:	Re: Nerfs are going ahead as planned Reply #12 - Oct 21^st, 2015 at 10:22am	Print Post
	Asheras wrote on Oct 21^st, 2015 at 10:18am: There is a difference between an over performing build and a non-WAI build.� �The players invest a lot of time to find the efficiencies and sweet spot combos of features and classes.� This results in fotm and over performing builds.� �If turbine follows the players and nerfs optimal designs the players come up with, it provides a disincentive to players enjoyment and efforts.� � They need to fix broken features that are being taken advantage of.� But be careful about chasing away the build optimizer crowd.� This. They have no clue how the game works, so everytime they do some "change" some ppl find a few fotm. Nerf those is dumb and retarded.

	Dear players, The D&D rules you were familiar with were too simple to understand, so we're continuing our move away from them to needlessly confusing subsystems that will make your play experience less fun and invalidate old builds and loot. We hope you have fun working out what the fuck MRR, PRR, MP, SP, RP, CL, MCL and all the other bullshit we made up whilst drunk means. Love, People who don't know how to fix their own mistakes cleanly
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Durk The Deranged Offline I've got a secret! Posts: 705 Location: The Harbor Joined: May 15^th, 2012 Gender:	Re: Nerfs are going ahead as planned Reply #13 - Oct 21^st, 2015 at 10:23am	Print Post
	[] wrote on Oct 20^th, 2015 at 6:16pm: <Vargouille>: I do not expect us to do zero of the proposed changes. That is ... very unlikely. At least he was vague about some changes not making it.


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Durk The Deranged Offline I've got a secret! Posts: 705 Location: The Harbor Joined: May 15^th, 2012 Gender:	Re: Nerfs are going ahead as planned Reply #14 - Oct 21^st, 2015 at 10:24am	Print Post
	[] wrote on Oct 20^th, 2015 at 6:16pm: <DDOChatter_25>: varg: any chance you guyswill just call off all proposed changes to the game and leave it alone? [] wrote on Oct 20^th, 2015 at 6:16pm: I tried to get them to leave the game alone; request denied. Hiding this time to avoid being banned? HuHuHu.


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Meursault Horoluth Raider Offline I Love Freedom of Speech Posts: 2410 Location: Hartford, CT; USA Joined: Aug 22^nd, 2013 Gender:	Re: Nerfs are going ahead as planned Reply #15 - Oct 21^st, 2015 at 10:25am	Print Post
	Asheras wrote on Oct 21^st, 2015 at 10:18am: They need to fix broken features that are being taken advantage of. But be careful about chasing away the build optimizer crowd. Also be careful of chasing away the non-build optimizer crowd - a nerf to per hit proc CC effects takes a huge toll on less experienced players who were just following a path. They are probably a bigger crowd than the build optimizers, and they are less resilient in the face of nerfs like this. An optimizer will hunt around and find the next best combo, a path follower will just suffer and complain how the game sucks. It's a lose-lose proposition, how typically Turdbin

	Turdbin, keep changing the DDO rules, because McDonalds sold over 200 billion hamburgers by changing the recipe for their Special Sauce every couple of months to keep interest up.
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[] Madame President Offline Posts: 10532 Joined: Oct 16^th, 2015	Re: Nerfs are going ahead as planned Reply #16 - Oct 22^nd, 2015 at 11:43am	Print Post
	Meursault wrote on Oct 21^st, 2015 at 10:25am: a nerf to per hit proc CC effects takes a huge toll on less experienced players who were just following a path. They are probably a bigger crowd than the build optimizers, and they are less resilient in the face of nerfs like this. An optimizer will hunt around and find the next best combo, a path follower will just suffer and complain how the game sucks. this, so much this!


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yardarm Ex Member	Re: Nerfs are going ahead as planned Reply #17 - Oct 22^nd, 2015 at 11:46am	Print Post
	[] wrote on Oct 22^nd, 2015 at 11:43am: this, so much this! ???? but hasn't he been bragging to everyone: [] wrote on Oct 21^st, 2015 at 5:01pm: i'm done playing. Def remember: [] wrote on Oct 21^st, 2015 at 5:01pm: since they announced the nerf-holocaust: i'm done playing. Guess it's no surprise he was lying when he said: [] wrote on Oct 21^st, 2015 at 5:01pm: dude, i haven't even logged in since they announced the nerf-holocaust: i'm done playing.
	« Last Edit: Oct 22^nd, 2015 at 11:47am by »

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Rubbinns The Undeserving Fuckwit Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 10460 Joined: Sep 4^th, 2013	Re: Nerfs are going ahead as planned Reply #18 - Oct 22^nd, 2015 at 2:11pm	Print Post
	Rubbinns wrote on Oct 21^st, 2015 at 9:35am: Light TF mortal fear no red augment took 25 seconds same test conducted right now had TF light repeater in at 40 seconds. Fucking rekt.

	Mockduck wrote on Aug 30^th, 2010 at 2:20pm: I don't think naming names would be a good thing for me to do, but I'd pretty much add anyone who's a know-it-all dick on the list.� Even if they are sometimes intelligent with their opinions, the way they state them in long, "i'm a lawyer at trial"-type posts makes me want to punch them in the face.� They act like whiney babies with god complexes and then freak out if someone so much as breathes criticism in their direction.
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Asheras Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline This is why we can't have nice things. Posts: 10230 Location: Ohio Joined: Jun 9^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: Nerfs are going ahead as planned Reply #19 - Oct 22^nd, 2015 at 2:31pm	Print Post
	Rubbinns wrote on Oct 22^nd, 2015 at 2:11pm: same test conducted right now had TF light repeater in at 40 seconds. Fucking rekt. Was that all RoF slow down or was the crit profile different from before too?


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Rubbinns The Undeserving Fuckwit Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 10460 Joined: Sep 4^th, 2013	Re: Nerfs are going ahead as planned Reply #20 - Oct 22^nd, 2015 at 2:32pm	Print Post
	Asheras wrote on Oct 22^nd, 2015 at 2:31pm: Was that all RoF slow down or was the crit profile different from before too? both the crit profile and reduced DS

	Mockduck wrote on Aug 30^th, 2010 at 2:20pm: I don't think naming names would be a good thing for me to do, but I'd pretty much add anyone who's a know-it-all dick on the list.� Even if they are sometimes intelligent with their opinions, the way they state them in long, "i'm a lawyer at trial"-type posts makes me want to punch them in the face.� They act like whiney babies with god complexes and then freak out if someone so much as breathes criticism in their direction.
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[] Madame President Offline Posts: 10532 Joined: Oct 16^th, 2015	Re: Nerfs are going ahead as planned Reply #21 - Oct 22^nd, 2015 at 2:33pm	Print Post
	keep playing ,and feel the burn...


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yardarm Ex Member	Re: Nerfs are going ahead as planned Reply #22 - Oct 22^nd, 2015 at 2:37pm	Print Post
	[] wrote on Oct 22^nd, 2015 at 2:33pm: keep playing , [] wrote on Oct 21^st, 2015 at 5:01pm: : i'm done playing. Yawn.


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dojhs Dirty Sock Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 79 Joined: Aug 23^rd, 2015	Re: Nerfs are going ahead as planned Reply #23 - Oct 22^nd, 2015 at 2:44pm	Print Post
	Quote: I'm desperate for attention and to be taken seriously.

	[] wrote on Oct 28^th, 2015 at 10:32pm: You seem upset Yardarm, why?� Is it because you can only take a Yard of a man's Arm up your ass when getting fisted, you� fake-tought, leather-waring, macho-man, Blue Oyster tango dancing, Village People wanna be faggot? [] wrote on Oct 28^th, 2015 at 10:40pm: You're the multi-sock faggot tthat just got exposed.� With all your socking, you must have no (none, zero [0]) life.� Takes alot of time, don it? [] wrote on Oct 28^th, 2015 at 9:29pm: Everyone keeps PM-ing me teling me what a fucking dumbass you are, and that I shouldn't even acknowledge you. Furthermore, they say you're just jumping on the jock-ride-KinNigNog's-nuts bandwagon in a futile, pathetic, worm-like attempt to improve your own standing in this "community' (FUCK LOL!) and that I should ignore you. By everyone, I mean the hissing sound that comes outta my dick .5 secs. before taking a piss that led me to call it "The King Cobra." Faggot.
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[] Madame President Offline Posts: 10532 Joined: Oct 16^th, 2015	Re: Nerfs are going ahead as planned Reply #24 - Oct 22^nd, 2015 at 3:39pm	Print Post
	srsly, why does anyone even play ddo anymore? don't tell me you consider those fellow no-lives who click yer LFM's "friends"!


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