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Persiflage
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Monk abilities and weapons
Sep 21st, 2013 at 6:03am
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Still plodding slowly through my toons applying enhancements...  :/

Does anyone know which Monk abilities work with weapons; as in, which abilities *actually* work as opposed to "ought to work"?  I'm thinking of turning my halfling dark monk into a dex-based stick build, but I'm not sure whether Touch of Despair, Touch of Death and so on work with q-staffs these days or not.

Also, am I correct in remembering that glancing blows don't work with sticks, so THF feats are pointless?

Cheers!
  
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Laraeph
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Re: Monk abilities and weapons
Reply #1 - Sep 21st, 2013 at 6:08am
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The only ability that I know of not working with weapons for monks is stunning fist.
And, QStaves do have glancing blows. They just don't have it on cleaves (contrary to other THF weapons), but they do get them on normal attacks just fine.
  
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Persiflage
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Re: Monk abilities and weapons
Reply #2 - Sep 21st, 2013 at 6:20am
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Laraeph wrote on Sep 21st, 2013 at 6:08am:
The only ability that I know of not working with weapons for monks is stunning fist.
And, QStaves do have glancing blows. They just don't have it on cleaves (contrary to other THF weapons), but they do get them on normal attacks just fine.


Ahhh... that's where I'm getting confused.  Thanks!  Smiley

ToD works with sticks, huh?  This should be interesting...
  
stainer wrote on May 16th, 2013 at 9:26am:
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QuantumFX wrote on Jun 5th, 2013 at 11:11am:
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m4lacka wrote on Mar 29th, 2014 at 7:04am:
wow that post hurt a lot more than any of the namecalling i expected. Now I see why ppl consider you evil.
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Re: Monk abilities and weapons
Reply #3 - Sep 21st, 2013 at 9:23am
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Persiflage wrote on Sep 21st, 2013 at 6:20am:
ToD works with sticks, huh?  This should be interesting...

If you're going the Touch of Death route, you really want to be able to stun the target for the additional 30% from No Mercy (and more from twisted Sense Weakness).  Since you can't usie Stunning Fist with Sireth, you probably want to go tier5 Henshin or Acrobat.
  
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Persiflage
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Re: Monk abilities and weapons
Reply #4 - Sep 21st, 2013 at 9:55am
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Carpone wrote on Sep 21st, 2013 at 9:23am:
If you're going the Touch of Death route, you really want to be able to stun the target for the additional 30% from No Mercy (and more from twisted Sense Weakness).  Since you can't usie Stunning Fist with Sireth, you probably want to go tier5 Henshin or Acrobat.


Honestly, I'm never going to pick up Sireth anyway but I very much appreciate the guidance and it still stands.  I was thinking (not very hard at this point) either pure monk or 12 monk / 6 Rogue / 2 Fighter (or even Druid for doublestrike boost).

Shows how rusty I'm getting...  I hadn't even considered the fact that Stunning Blow isn't going to work on this toon and SF won't be viable  :/  Might need to rethink...
  
stainer wrote on May 16th, 2013 at 9:26am:
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m4lacka wrote on Mar 29th, 2014 at 7:04am:
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Re: Monk abilities and weapons
Reply #5 - Sep 21st, 2013 at 11:18am
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If you ask me, it's kind of BS that ki attacks don't work with ranged. Monkchers need more DPS.
  
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Re: Monk abilities and weapons
Reply #6 - Sep 21st, 2013 at 3:40pm
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Laraeph wrote on Sep 21st, 2013 at 6:08am:
And, QStaves do have glancing blows. They just don't have it on cleaves (contrary to other THF weapons), but they do get them on normal attacks just fine.


anyone got an explanation for that btw ? or is it just turbined ?
« Last Edit: Sep 21st, 2013 at 3:41pm by »  
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Re: Monk abilities and weapons
Reply #7 - Sep 21st, 2013 at 4:02pm
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It's turbined.
  
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Persiflage
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Re: Monk abilities and weapons
Reply #8 - Sep 21st, 2013 at 4:30pm
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cdr wrote on Sep 21st, 2013 at 4:02pm:
It's turbined.


That's a terrible shock.  No, really.

*sigh*

No stuns AND dex-based isn't going to work on a stick build; I need to find something else to do with a halfling monk.  This wouldn't be a problem, except that I already have one pure wrap-using halfling monk and don't need another.  Hmmm.
  
stainer wrote on May 16th, 2013 at 9:26am:
Oh you are good. I will be watching you.


QuantumFX wrote on Jun 5th, 2013 at 11:11am:
You are an evil human being. 


m4lacka wrote on Mar 29th, 2014 at 7:04am:
wow that post hurt a lot more than any of the namecalling i expected. Now I see why ppl consider you evil.
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Re: Monk abilities and weapons
Reply #9 - Sep 21st, 2013 at 9:37pm
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acrobat has a dex based cleave/trip and if you go pure a no save trip on vorpal.

pretty rad. also new monk finishers in NS neg levels everything around you.

you don't need to stun things if you can get get SA damage as a rogue.
  
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Persiflage
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Re: Monk abilities and weapons
Reply #10 - Sep 22nd, 2013 at 5:25am
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harharharhar wrote on Sep 21st, 2013 at 9:37pm:
acrobat has a dex based cleave/trip and if you go pure a no save trip on vorpal.

pretty rad. also new monk finishers in NS neg levels everything around you.

you don't need to stun things if you can get get SA damage as a rogue.


I hear ya, but a monk with no stuns is a bacon sammitch without ketchup.  Wink

Also, doesn't boss DPS end up rather lacking in that approach? I may do this anyway for shits and giggles; still torn over pure Monk vs. deep-splash to Rogue...
  
stainer wrote on May 16th, 2013 at 9:26am:
Oh you are good. I will be watching you.


QuantumFX wrote on Jun 5th, 2013 at 11:11am:
You are an evil human being. 


m4lacka wrote on Mar 29th, 2014 at 7:04am:
wow that post hurt a lot more than any of the namecalling i expected. Now I see why ppl consider you evil.
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Re: Monk abilities and weapons
Reply #11 - Sep 22nd, 2013 at 9:12am
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I'll say it again:

Sneak Attack = DPS.

You can't stun a red/purple named
  
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Persiflage
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Re: Monk abilities and weapons
Reply #12 - Sep 22nd, 2013 at 5:37pm
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harharharhar wrote on Sep 22nd, 2013 at 9:12am:
I'll say it again:

Sneak Attack = DPS.


You can say it as many times as you like, but if I'm not making my enemies helpless, I'm not getting SA damage unless I get deception into the mix somehow.  Solo = 100% aggro.  :/

Meh, I should just stop worrying about the lack of Overwhelming Critical and enjoy the fact that I ought to be very hard to squish with a Dex-focused toon  Cool  I dunno; the option's there, but every time I think of actually starting to build it my very soul rebels against the notion of ignoring strength  Wink
  
stainer wrote on May 16th, 2013 at 9:26am:
Oh you are good. I will be watching you.


QuantumFX wrote on Jun 5th, 2013 at 11:11am:
You are an evil human being. 


m4lacka wrote on Mar 29th, 2014 at 7:04am:
wow that post hurt a lot more than any of the namecalling i expected. Now I see why ppl consider you evil.
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Re: Monk abilities and weapons
Reply #13 - Sep 22nd, 2013 at 5:56pm
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Persiflage wrote on Sep 22nd, 2013 at 5:37pm:
You can say it as many times as you like, but if I'm not making my enemies helpless, I'm not getting SA damage unless I get deception into the mix somehow


Go look up unbalancing strike.
  
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Re: Monk abilities and weapons
Reply #14 - Sep 22nd, 2013 at 8:42pm
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Munkenmo wrote on Sep 22nd, 2013 at 5:56pm:
Go look up unbalancing strike.


Or Deception, Improved Deception, Radiance (weapon proc), Trip (Str based or Acrobat Dex based which is an AoE trip BTW), or any number of other ways of getting SA damage solo.
  
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Re: Monk abilities and weapons
Reply #15 - Sep 23rd, 2013 at 3:42am
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Munkenmo wrote on Sep 22nd, 2013 at 5:56pm:
Go look up unbalancing strike.


This works so beautifully with SA that I feel it's gonna get Turbine'd soon.
  
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Persiflage
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Re: Monk abilities and weapons
Reply #16 - Sep 23rd, 2013 at 3:59am
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harharharhar wrote on Sep 22nd, 2013 at 8:42pm:
Or Deception, Improved Deception, Radiance (weapon proc), Trip (Str based or Acrobat Dex based which is an AoE trip BTW), or any number of other ways of getting SA damage solo.


Deception I mentioned myself and I've not found radiance to proc terribly often...  As for trip, does that now render opponents vulnerable to sneak attacks?  I thought it was always just an AC penalty and no actions, but if it allows sneak damage, that's sweet.

I've had tripper toons and I've had SA damage toons, but I've never had one that does both so it's not terribly surprising if I've overlooked it.
  
stainer wrote on May 16th, 2013 at 9:26am:
Oh you are good. I will be watching you.


QuantumFX wrote on Jun 5th, 2013 at 11:11am:
You are an evil human being. 


m4lacka wrote on Mar 29th, 2014 at 7:04am:
wow that post hurt a lot more than any of the namecalling i expected. Now I see why ppl consider you evil.
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Persiflage
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Re: Monk abilities and weapons
Reply #17 - Sep 23rd, 2013 at 4:07am
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Munkenmo wrote on Sep 22nd, 2013 at 5:56pm:
Go look up unbalancing strike.


I had completely forgotten about that, thanks   Cool  I'll have a play with it next time I can log in...

I can see it now; I'll fiddle around with the build, arrive at a dex-plus-SA toon I like, and then Update 20: Zombie Apocalypse will come along and render it useless  Wink
  
stainer wrote on May 16th, 2013 at 9:26am:
Oh you are good. I will be watching you.


QuantumFX wrote on Jun 5th, 2013 at 11:11am:
You are an evil human being. 


m4lacka wrote on Mar 29th, 2014 at 7:04am:
wow that post hurt a lot more than any of the namecalling i expected. Now I see why ppl consider you evil.
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Re: Monk abilities and weapons
Reply #18 - Sep 23rd, 2013 at 7:49am
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Unless there is something new I don't know about, trip doesn't allow sneak attack damage (except the knockdown from FotW).
  
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Re: Monk abilities and weapons
Reply #19 - Sep 23rd, 2013 at 8:07am
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Slug wrote on Sep 23rd, 2013 at 7:49am:
Unless there is something new I don't know about, trip doesn't allow sneak attack damage (except the knockdown from FotW).


Overwhelming Force is a knock down effect that allows SA and helpless damage.
  
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Re: Monk abilities and weapons
Reply #20 - Sep 23rd, 2013 at 9:24am
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Slug wrote on Sep 23rd, 2013 at 7:49am:
Unless there is something new I don't know about, trip doesn't allow sneak attack damage (except the knockdown from FotW).


Hs anyone tested the AoE trip from Acrobat? I haven't been able to yet for SA but will once the server comes up.

My bad on Str Based Trip I haven't used it in forever I incorrectly assumed it did like FoTW knockdown
« Last Edit: Sep 23rd, 2013 at 9:28am by harharharhar »  
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Re: Monk abilities and weapons
Reply #21 - Sep 23rd, 2013 at 9:27am
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Persiflage wrote on Sep 23rd, 2013 at 3:59am:
Deception I mentioned myself and I've not found radiance to proc terribly often...  As for trip, does that now render opponents vulnerable to sneak attacks?  I thought it was always just an AC penalty and no actions, but if it allows sneak damage, that's sweet.

I've had tripper toons and I've had SA damage toons, but I've never had one that does both so it's not terribly surprising if I've overlooked it.


Radiance is on crit, and there's lots of ways to get it, the best of course being GS. I have some rapiers laying around form when they had it generating on lootgen until u19. There's a shortsword that can get it from turn in's in Eveningstar, and of course Celestia.
  
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Re: Monk abilities and weapons
Reply #22 - Sep 23rd, 2013 at 9:38am
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harharharhar wrote on Sep 23rd, 2013 at 9:27am:
Radiance is on crit,


But the blindness proc is a chance per crit and it has never seemed to be a very high chance, to me.  I haven't spent a lot of time playing with rad weapons though; I had a rogue with a GS rad weapons, but that's about it.

harharharhar wrote on Sep 23rd, 2013 at 9:27am:
...and there's lots of ways to get it, the best of course being GS.


That's out for me, these days.  I'm never able to log on long enough at once to run a shroud.  Hell, I think I only have one toon left who's flagged for it...

harharharhar wrote on Sep 23rd, 2013 at 9:27am:
I have some rapiers laying around form when they had it generating on lootgen until u19. There's a shortsword that can get it from turn in's in Eveningstar, and of course Celestia.


Stick build.  I actually do have a q-staff with Radiance on it, but it's ML23 so not terribly useful for levelling   Smiley
  
stainer wrote on May 16th, 2013 at 9:26am:
Oh you are good. I will be watching you.


QuantumFX wrote on Jun 5th, 2013 at 11:11am:
You are an evil human being. 


m4lacka wrote on Mar 29th, 2014 at 7:04am:
wow that post hurt a lot more than any of the namecalling i expected. Now I see why ppl consider you evil.
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Persiflage
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Re: Monk abilities and weapons
Reply #23 - Sep 23rd, 2013 at 9:39am
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Slug wrote on Sep 23rd, 2013 at 7:49am:
Unless there is something new I don't know about, trip doesn't allow sneak attack damage (except the knockdown from FotW).


That's what I thought.  Dang.  :/
  
stainer wrote on May 16th, 2013 at 9:26am:
Oh you are good. I will be watching you.


QuantumFX wrote on Jun 5th, 2013 at 11:11am:
You are an evil human being. 


m4lacka wrote on Mar 29th, 2014 at 7:04am:
wow that post hurt a lot more than any of the namecalling i expected. Now I see why ppl consider you evil.
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Re: Monk abilities and weapons
Reply #24 - Sep 23rd, 2013 at 11:58am
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Blindness from Radiance is no-save.

You might be thinking of Sirocco/Greater Sirocco (like on the the Elemental Rapier of Air) which does have a save (17/35 reflex, respectively.)
  
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