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Wizazrd Version of the Undead Shiradi (Read 7080 times)

Digimonk Puppy Farmer Offline Posts: 1573 Joined: Apr 7^th, 2015	Wizazrd Version of the Undead Shiradi Jun 15^th, 2016 at 4:13pm	Print Post
	I'm getting ready to do a wizard life.� DC casting and palemasters don't appeal to me much.� Eth's undead Shirdai looks like fun though. To do with a wizard icon, I would need to swap the wizard and sorcerer levels.� I realize I will take a hit to DPS output due to lower caster levels on the sorcerer's faster casting and shorter cooldown SLAs and spells.� In exchange, I think it will gain some flexibility and utility through extra spellbook slots and an additional feat. I prefer to level the builds from 1 to 30 then TR to get the epic and heroic PLs rather than stoning or using an Iconic so that I learn the ins and outs of the build.� I also tend to stay at 30 for a while to do some end-game raiding before TRing as long as whatever build I'm on is EE/LE capable. My experience with Shiradi casters is limited and I would greatly appreciate any feedback on this idea from the resident shiradi experts.� In particular, is this just a terrible idea all around? Will the hit to DPS be large? If so, I would welcome any suggestions for alternate Wizard icon options. I saw the mention of Eth's build being painful to level. Will this make it noticeably worse?
	« Last Edit: Jun 15^th, 2016 at 4:15pm by Digimonk »

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Rubbinns The Undeserving Fuckwit Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 10460 Joined: Sep 4^th, 2013	Re: Wizazrd Version of the Undead Shiradi Reply #1 - Jun 15^th, 2016 at 4:43pm	Print Post
	You could 9wiz/7sor/4fvs. That gets cl of 11 for sorc chain missile with 2 ap into intense faith and doj gloves equipped. 6 projectiles every 2 seconds still beats 9 every 4 seconds. You get access to 2 5th level spells from wizard level 9.

	Mockduck wrote on Aug 30^th, 2010 at 2:20pm: I don't think naming names would be a good thing for me to do, but I'd pretty much add anyone who's a know-it-all dick on the list.� Even if they are sometimes intelligent with their opinions, the way they state them in long, "i'm a lawyer at trial"-type posts makes me want to punch them in the face.� They act like whiney babies with god complexes and then freak out if someone so much as breathes criticism in their direction.
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AtomicMew Horoluth Raider Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 2073 Joined: Jan 12^th, 2011	Re: Wizazrd Version of the Undead Shiradi Reply #2 - Jun 15^th, 2016 at 5:55pm	Print Post
	16 wizard/4 FvS. It's really not a big DPS hit, if at all. Higher caster levels mean you get better mileage out of arcane blast/bolt, which you'll need to use for master of knowledge.


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SpaceGoat Stormreaver Piker Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 597 Joined: Oct 14^th, 2015	Re: Wizazrd Version of the Undead Shiradi Reply #3 - Jun 15^th, 2016 at 6:24pm	Print Post
	AtomicMew wrote on Jun 15^th, 2016 at 5:55pm: 16 wizard/4 FvS.� It's really not a big DPS hit, if at all.� Higher caster levels mean you get better mileage out of arcane blast/bolt, which you'll need to use for master of knowledge.� Arcane bolt & blast are not great sources of DPS compared to missiles


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AtomicMew Horoluth Raider Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 2073 Joined: Jan 12^th, 2011	Re: Wizazrd Version of the Undead Shiradi Reply #4 - Jun 15^th, 2016 at 6:39pm	Print Post
	SpaceGoat wrote on Jun 15^th, 2016 at 6:24pm: Arcane bolt & blast are not great sources of DPS compared to missiles Yes, but do you understand that both versions need to cast it anyway?


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Digimonk Puppy Farmer Offline Posts: 1573 Joined: Apr 7^th, 2015	Re: Wizazrd Version of the Undead Shiradi Reply #5 - Jun 16^th, 2016 at 12:28am	Print Post
	Thanks for the advice.


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DoRayEgon Shroud Slacker Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 1042 Joined: Apr 4^th, 2014	Re: Wizazrd Version of the Undead Shiradi Reply #6 - Jun 16^th, 2016 at 9:20am	Print Post
	AtomicMew wrote on Jun 15^th, 2016 at 5:55pm: 16 wizard/4 FvS.� It's really not a big DPS hit, if at all.� Higher caster levels mean you get better mileage out of arcane blast/bolt, which you'll need to use for master of knowledge.� Yes, run this before and can confirm it's not that far off. You hit max levels on chain missile, but lose the extra casting speed and extra rotations of missiles. It actually worked better than I though it would.


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Digimonk Puppy Farmer Offline Posts: 1573 Joined: Apr 7^th, 2015	Re: Wizazrd Version of the Undead Shiradi Reply #7 - Jun 16^th, 2016 at 11:20am	Print Post
	DoRayEgon wrote on Jun 16^th, 2016 at 9:20am: Yes, run this before and can confirm it's not that far off.� You hit max levels on chain missile, but lose the extra casting speed and extra rotations of missiles.� It actually worked better than I though it would. Thanks for the confirmation. I think the 16/4 is what I will try. The simplicity of a two class split versus three might make it easier to get familiar with the intricacies of a wizard and Shiradi since it will be my first non-warlock version.


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Rubbinns The Undeserving Fuckwit Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 10460 Joined: Sep 4^th, 2013	Re: Wizazrd Version of the Undead Shiradi Reply #8 - Jun 16^th, 2016 at 11:28am	Print Post
	Digimonk wrote on Jun 16^th, 2016 at 11:20am: Thanks for the confirmation.� I think the 16/4 is what I will try.� The simplicity of a two class split versus three might make it easier to get familiar with the intricacies of a wizard and Shiradi since it will be my first non-warlock version. I wouldn't trade faster missile spam for any of the other perks on a shiradi. 1 second mm and 2 second cm builds up just rewards faster than you can spend it. Not so for the wiz builds. To get the same effect on a wiz only you have to include both slas and both arcane slas in there just to get a full rotation of force spells�to proc just rewards. Also arcane slas can be evaded.�
	« Last Edit: Jun 16^th, 2016 at 11:29am by Rubbinns »
	Mockduck wrote on Aug 30^th, 2010 at 2:20pm: I don't think naming names would be a good thing for me to do, but I'd pretty much add anyone who's a know-it-all dick on the list.� Even if they are sometimes intelligent with their opinions, the way they state them in long, "i'm a lawyer at trial"-type posts makes me want to punch them in the face.� They act like whiney babies with god complexes and then freak out if someone so much as breathes criticism in their direction.
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Digimonk Puppy Farmer Offline Posts: 1573 Joined: Apr 7^th, 2015	Re: Wizazrd Version of the Undead Shiradi Reply #9 - Jun 16^th, 2016 at 12:29pm	Print Post
	Rubbinns wrote on Jun 16^th, 2016 at 11:28am: I wouldn't trade faster missile spam for any of the other perks on a shiradi. 1 second mm and 2 second cm builds up just rewards faster than you can spend it. Not so for the wiz builds. To get the same effect on a wiz only you have to include both slas and both arcane slas in there just to get a full rotation of force spells�to proc just rewards. Also arcane slas can be evaded.� Hmm.� �Have to use at least one of the arcane SLAs to keep MoK stacked anyway.� I realize it won't be as good as MM or CM but I could always include Scorching Ray in the rotation. I guess worst case scenario is that I try the non-sorcerer version and burn a +5 heart or two if it doesn't cut it.
	« Last Edit: Jun 16^th, 2016 at 12:30pm by Digimonk »

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DoRayEgon Shroud Slacker Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 1042 Joined: Apr 4^th, 2014	Re: Wizazrd Version of the Undead Shiradi Reply #10 - Jun 16^th, 2016 at 1:43pm	Print Post
	Rubbinns wrote on Jun 16^th, 2016 at 11:28am: I wouldn't trade faster missile spam for any of the other perks on a shiradi. 1 second mm and 2 second cm builds up just rewards faster than you can spend it. Not so for the wiz builds. To get the same effect on a wiz only you have to include both slas and both arcane slas in there just to get a full rotation of force spells�to proc just rewards. Also arcane slas can be evaded.� A 10/6/4 or 9/7/4 split is definitely better, but easier to go 1-20 on a 16/4. I would call it a nice beginners build for shiradi. Eth or Gold's build is the pinnacle however.


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AtomicMew Horoluth Raider Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 2073 Joined: Jan 12^th, 2011	Re: Wizazrd Version of the Undead Shiradi Reply #11 - Jun 16^th, 2016 at 2:54pm	Print Post
	Rubbinns wrote on Jun 16^th, 2016 at 11:28am: I wouldn't trade faster missile spam for any of the other perks on a shiradi. 1 second mm and 2 second cm builds up just rewards faster than you can spend it. Not so for the wiz builds. To get the same effect on a wiz only you have to include both slas and both arcane slas in there just to get a full rotation of force spells�to proc just rewards. Also arcane slas can be evaded.� People have been playing shiradi sorcs and wizards since Motu. It's not like wizard casting has suddenly become majorly outclassed. As far as normal gameplay, you're almost never at max MOK with exception of shroud part 1, which means you'll generally want to spam bolt/blast as much as possible. Of course it's different story if you're trying to solo thubderpeaks. On a side note, I also don't know if it's settled how chain missile works with caster level.


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Rubbinns The Undeserving Fuckwit Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 10460 Joined: Sep 4^th, 2013	Re: Wizazrd Version of the Undead Shiradi Reply #12 - Jun 16^th, 2016 at 3:12pm	Print Post
	Digimonk wrote on Jun 16^th, 2016 at 12:29pm: �Have to use at least one of the arcane SLAs to keep MoK stacked anyway.� Take both and 3 ap into each. Gets them to fastest cooldown. AtomicMew wrote on Jun 16^th, 2016 at 2:54pm: � It's not like wizard casting has suddenly become majorly outclassed.� There is really no bigger benefit gained by taking so many wizard levels, in fact I think it is a loss of dps and much less efficient use of Just rewards proc. 2 button spam op. AtomicMew wrote on Jun 16^th, 2016 at 2:54pm: On a side note, I also don't know if it's settled how chain missile works with caster level. the initial target gets the max cl of projectiles. That I'm sure of. The surrounding mobs get 10 regardless of the cl? Not sure of. I would lama and see, but not up.

	Mockduck wrote on Aug 30^th, 2010 at 2:20pm: I don't think naming names would be a good thing for me to do, but I'd pretty much add anyone who's a know-it-all dick on the list.� Even if they are sometimes intelligent with their opinions, the way they state them in long, "i'm a lawyer at trial"-type posts makes me want to punch them in the face.� They act like whiney babies with god complexes and then freak out if someone so much as breathes criticism in their direction.
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DoRayEgon Shroud Slacker Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 1042 Joined: Apr 4^th, 2014	Re: Wizazrd Version of the Undead Shiradi Reply #13 - Jun 16^th, 2016 at 4:52pm	Print Post
	...or just say eff it and run a 12 FVS/8 SOC and just spam some blade barriers,SLA fireballs, SLA scorch and some magic missiles till you drop dead.


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Tilo Ex Member	Re: Wizazrd Version of the Undead Shiradi Reply #14 - Jun 16^th, 2016 at 6:35pm	Print Post
	2 rogue, for evasion and trapping? Would still put a 14/4/2 at CL 17 CM.
	« Last Edit: Jun 16^th, 2016 at 6:37pm by »

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Rubbinns The Undeserving Fuckwit Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 10460 Joined: Sep 4^th, 2013	Re: Wizazrd Version of the Undead Shiradi Reply #15 - Jun 16^th, 2016 at 7:28pm	Print Post
	DoRayEgon wrote on Jun 16^th, 2016 at 4:52pm: ...or just say eff it and run a 12 FVS/8 SOC and just spam some blade barriers,SLA fireballs, SLA scorch and some magic missiles till you drop dead. Archmage is the best tier 5 shiradis have because of Supremacy, stacks maximize with fvs(not sure any of sorc savant does) and has critical force % chance increase. take a 16/4 vs 9/7/6 the 16/4 gets to max cl w/o any gear by taking tier 3 intense faith. the 9/7 needs tier 2 and doj gloves to get 13/11. rotation of CM(4), CM sla(8), is 20 projectiles for 16 wiz, then both arcane slas(6 each). Next rotation is CM, both arcane slas, and something before both cm and cm sla come off cooldown. in 8 seconds that is 2 casts of cm and 1 cm sla for 30 missiles. the 9/7sorc gets 6 every 2 seconds. 24 projectiles from cm and 7 from cm sla. 31 missiles. Only 1 missile higher, but Just Rewards gets better due to frequency of casting CM every 2 seconds. Even better against single targets because mm is 1 second. A maximized cm is 13 sp, a maximized and quickened mm is 12. With a 1-2 combo it is almost impossible to not constantly take temp sp to cast them off just rewards while never having to actually use your spell points.� �
	« Last Edit: Jun 16^th, 2016 at 7:29pm by Rubbinns »
	Mockduck wrote on Aug 30^th, 2010 at 2:20pm: I don't think naming names would be a good thing for me to do, but I'd pretty much add anyone who's a know-it-all dick on the list.� Even if they are sometimes intelligent with their opinions, the way they state them in long, "i'm a lawyer at trial"-type posts makes me want to punch them in the face.� They act like whiney babies with god complexes and then freak out if someone so much as breathes criticism in their direction.
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WonderfulFoppyBint Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline Poooop Posts: 5947 Location: stockholm victim of hag master Joined: Oct 23^rd, 2013	Re: Wizazrd Version of the Undead Shiradi Reply #16 - Jun 16^th, 2016 at 7:51pm	Print Post
	17 wiz / 3 fvs Meteor swarm is excellent. Not sure how it stacks up nowadays but always felt like the spell was epic on shiradi. If this is for a pl then you may want to go melee 6 fighter / 6 ranger / 8 wizard. Sprint boost, stalwart, Kensai multipler

	OUR GOD: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j1l7N-WLa3Q Right of Self-determination: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-8bqQ-C1PSE volt_ wrote on Mar 23^rd, 2017 at 4:43pm: Be a container for your genes to control your behavior in order to reproduce
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WonderfulFoppyBint Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline Poooop Posts: 5947 Location: stockholm victim of hag master Joined: Oct 23^rd, 2013	Re: Wizazrd Version of the Undead Shiradi Reply #17 - Jun 16^th, 2016 at 7:55pm	Print Post
	epic levels are giving caster levels on some spells according to some guildies.... My shiradienfreude is giving me 9 chain middles @ 30

	OUR GOD: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j1l7N-WLa3Q Right of Self-determination: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-8bqQ-C1PSE volt_ wrote on Mar 23^rd, 2017 at 4:43pm: Be a container for your genes to control your behavior in order to reproduce
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WonderfulFoppyBint Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline Poooop Posts: 5947 Location: stockholm victim of hag master Joined: Oct 23^rd, 2013	Re: Wizazrd Version of the Undead Shiradi Reply #18 - Jun 16^th, 2016 at 7:59pm	Print Post
	9 wiz / 3 barb / 8 fighter if 2hf

	OUR GOD: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j1l7N-WLa3Q Right of Self-determination: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-8bqQ-C1PSE volt_ wrote on Mar 23^rd, 2017 at 4:43pm: Be a container for your genes to control your behavior in order to reproduce
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Rubbinns The Undeserving Fuckwit Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 10460 Joined: Sep 4^th, 2013	Re: Wizazrd Version of the Undead Shiradi Reply #19 - Jun 16^th, 2016 at 8:10pm	Print Post
	WonderfulFoppyBint wrote on Jun 16^th, 2016 at 7:55pm: epic levels are giving caster levels on some spells according to some guildies.... My shiradienfreude is giving me 9 chain middles @ 30 I'm not getting that. On 13wiz, tier 2 faith+doj gloves gets me : (Combat): You begin to cast Chain Missiles at level 17

	Mockduck wrote on Aug 30^th, 2010 at 2:20pm: I don't think naming names would be a good thing for me to do, but I'd pretty much add anyone who's a know-it-all dick on the list.� Even if they are sometimes intelligent with their opinions, the way they state them in long, "i'm a lawyer at trial"-type posts makes me want to punch them in the face.� They act like whiney babies with god complexes and then freak out if someone so much as breathes criticism in their direction.
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Rubbinns The Undeserving Fuckwit Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 10460 Joined: Sep 4^th, 2013	Re: Wizazrd Version of the Undead Shiradi Reply #20 - Jun 16^th, 2016 at 8:20pm	Print Post
	Rubbinns wrote on Jun 16^th, 2016 at 3:12pm: the initial target gets the max cl of projectiles. That I'm sure of. The surrounding mobs get 10 regardless of the cl? Not sure of. I would lama and see, but not up. am wrong. It's only ever 1 missile on main target and cl on surrounding targets. Getting 8 on my cl 17 wiz vs off-targets.

	Mockduck wrote on Aug 30^th, 2010 at 2:20pm: I don't think naming names would be a good thing for me to do, but I'd pretty much add anyone who's a know-it-all dick on the list.� Even if they are sometimes intelligent with their opinions, the way they state them in long, "i'm a lawyer at trial"-type posts makes me want to punch them in the face.� They act like whiney babies with god complexes and then freak out if someone so much as breathes criticism in their direction.
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ElGuapo Dragon Raider Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 215 Joined: Aug 7^th, 2014	Re: Wizazrd Version of the Undead Shiradi Reply #21 - Jun 16^th, 2016 at 10:44pm	Print Post
	Rubbinns wrote on Jun 15^th, 2016 at 4:43pm: You could 9wiz/7sor/4fvs. That gets cl of 11 for sorc chain missile with 2 ap into intense faith and doj gloves equipped. 6 projectiles every 2 seconds still beats 9 every 4 seconds. You get access to 2 5th level spells from wizard level 9.� This. I ran that for my gnome iconic lives. went quick


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AtomicMew Horoluth Raider Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 2073 Joined: Jan 12^th, 2011	Re: Wizazrd Version of the Undead Shiradi Reply #22 - Jun 16^th, 2016 at 10:49pm	Print Post
	Rubbinns wrote on Jun 16^th, 2016 at 8:20pm: am wrong. It's only ever 1 missile on main target and cl on surrounding targets. Getting 8 on my cl 17 wiz vs off-targets. 8 total or 8 per? Also, shouldn't you be getting 9 at CL 17?


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Rubbinns The Undeserving Fuckwit Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 10460 Joined: Sep 4^th, 2013	Re: Wizazrd Version of the Undead Shiradi Reply #23 - Jun 16^th, 2016 at 11:43pm	Print Post
	AtomicMew wrote on Jun 16^th, 2016 at 10:49pm: 8 total or 8 per?� Also, shouldn't you be getting 9 at CL 17?� Per each off-target. Yes, I should be getting 9, but sometimes it's 6, sometimes it's 10. idk wtf is going with chain missile. I'm testing in epic orchard, in LD destiny to eliminate shiradi procs, without lantern ring or resonation.

	Mockduck wrote on Aug 30^th, 2010 at 2:20pm: I don't think naming names would be a good thing for me to do, but I'd pretty much add anyone who's a know-it-all dick on the list.� Even if they are sometimes intelligent with their opinions, the way they state them in long, "i'm a lawyer at trial"-type posts makes me want to punch them in the face.� They act like whiney babies with god complexes and then freak out if someone so much as breathes criticism in their direction.
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Rubbinns The Undeserving Fuckwit Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 10460 Joined: Sep 4^th, 2013	Re: Wizazrd Version of the Undead Shiradi Reply #24 - Jun 17^th, 2016 at 12:14am	Print Post
	Yeah, I dont think CL even counts. I took off doj gloves and was still getting 6-10 on off-targets. This makes sorc Chain Missile even better.

	Mockduck wrote on Aug 30^th, 2010 at 2:20pm: I don't think naming names would be a good thing for me to do, but I'd pretty much add anyone who's a know-it-all dick on the list.� Even if they are sometimes intelligent with their opinions, the way they state them in long, "i'm a lawyer at trial"-type posts makes me want to punch them in the face.� They act like whiney babies with god complexes and then freak out if someone so much as breathes criticism in their direction.
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