Could you be more specific in what it is that you are looking for?  I get the only for a TR life part, but...

1. What constitutes gimp to you?
2. What do you want the bard to do primarily?

16bard, 2fighter, 2 rogue

go spell singer with maximise for your healing.

go human, build for overwhelming critical, ignore 2hf feats.

32pt stats would be 16/8/16/14/8/14

leveling order, rogue, fighter, 7bard, fighter, rogue, bard to cap.

As it's only a TR you could take less bard levels, but i'm fond of fascinating and running through shit, more fascinates = less time killing.

I can see it's only a TR, but I prefer cleaving for spiked / aoe damage to static 2hf boosts.

If you've got the SOS power critical would be a pretty good feat.

it's a past life build, is that extra bard level worth it whilst leveling?

id forgotten about pally dilly ><

I'd definitely go helf, but i'd still go 2hf cleaving, with extra fighter levels for feats.

I'm just going to add a couple of things to consider, as I really think you got some great responses. 

For a trapmonkey bard this was my take on it originally:

Xiomirah, a confused trapping spellsinger:

Bard 16 / Fighter 2 / Rogue 2
-Human
-
Level progression:
-
1.Rogue (Toughness, Two Weapon Fighting)
2.. Fighter (Power Attack)
3. Bard (Extend)
4. Bard
5. Bard
6. Fighter (Empower, Khopesh)
7. Bard
8. Bard
9. Bard (Imp Two Weapon Fighting)
10. Rogue
11. Bard
12. Bard (Imp Critical – Slashing)
13. Bard
14. Bard
15. Bard (Greater Two Weapon Fighting)
16. Bard
17. Bard
18. Bard (Combat Expertise Could do Oversized Two Weapon Fighting)
19. Bard
20. Bard
-
-
Stats:
-
Strength: 30 (16 base, 5 level ups, 1 enhancement, 6 item, 2 tome)
Dexterity: 22 (15 base, 2 tome, 5 item,)
Constitution: 26 (15 base, 2 tome, 1 enhancement, 6 item, 3 excep)
Intelligence: 16 (14 base, 2 tome) 22 (+6 item swapping as needed)
Wisdom: 16 (8 base, 6 item,+2 tome)
Charisma: 16 (8 base, 2 tome, 6 item) 

This was before half-elf was around.  I recently gave myself a sad turning her into a hagglebot temporarily.  I would totally build her again as a HElf with paladin dilly.  In fact I will do so if I can ever get my intended hagglebard to cap.  She's filling in right now.  She was a good utility build, able to heal parties if needed as well as get any trap in the game.  Melee was passable, she relied on flanking, but could hold her own soloing.  She lacked in high reflex situations though by a hair (Crucible Swim).  Pally Dilly and some different feat choices would make that a breeze.

This is my other primary bard, Elkabongg.  He's a frankenstein warchanter that is a work in progress.  Now I'm still doing feat swapping and such to rework him, but this was my original plan for him:

              Starting    Feat/Enhancement
Abilities    Base Stats    Modified Stats
(36 Point)    (Level 1)      (Level 20)
Strength           18                27
Dexterity           9                11
Constitution       16                19
Intelligence       10                12
Wisdom              9                11
Charisma           14                16

Tomes Used
+2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
+2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
+2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
+2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7
+2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7

             

Level 1 (Bard)
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Barbarian
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Bard
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Paladin
Feat: (Human Bonus) Power Attack
Feat: (Selected) Toughness

Level 2 (Bard)

Level 3 (Barbarian)
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Focus: Slashing Weapons

Level 4 (Barbarian)

Level 5 (Bard)

Level 6 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness

Level 7 (Bard)

Level 8 (Bard)

Level 9 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Extend Spell

Level 10 (Bard)

Level 11 (Bard)

Level 12 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Past Life: Soldier of the Faith

Level 13 (Bard)

Level 14 (Bard)

Level 15 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons
Feat: (Selected) Toughness

Level 16 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Quick Draw

Level 17 (Fighter)

Level 18 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Weapon Specialization: Slashing Weapons

Level 19 (Bard)

Level 20 (Bard)
Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost II
Enhancement: Barbarian Sprint Boost I
Enhancement: Barbarian Extra Rage I
Enhancement: Bard Extra Song I
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Attack I
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Attack II
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Attack III
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Bravery I
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Bravery II
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Bravery III
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Damage I
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Damage II
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Damage III
Enhancement: Bard Lingering Song I
Enhancement: Bard Lingering Song II
Enhancement: Bard Lingering Song III
Enhancement: Bard Lingering Song IV
Enhancement: Bard Warchanter I
Enhancement: Bard Warchanter II
Enhancement: Human Adaptability Strength I
Enhancement: Human Greater Adaptability Constitution I
Enhancement: Human Improved Recovery I
Enhancement: Human Improved Recovery II
Enhancement: Human Versatility I
Enhancement: Human Versatility II
Enhancement: Human Versatility III
Enhancement: Human Versatility IV
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Improved Perform I
Enhancement: Fighter Strength I
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness I
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness II
Enhancement: Bard Wand and Scroll Mastery I
Enhancement: Bard Wand and Scroll Mastery II


Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost II
Enhancement: Barbarian Sprint Boost I
Enhancement: Barbarian Extra Rage I
Enhancement: Bard Extra Song I
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Attack I
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Attack II
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Attack III
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Bravery I
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Bravery II
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Bravery III
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Damage I
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Damage II
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Damage III
Enhancement: Bard Lingering Song I
Enhancement: Bard Lingering Song II
Enhancement: Bard Lingering Song III
Enhancement: Bard Lingering Song IV
Enhancement: Bard Warchanter I
Enhancement: Bard Warchanter II
Enhancement: Human Adaptability Strength I
Enhancement: Human Greater Adaptability Constitution I
Enhancement: Human Improved Recovery I
Enhancement: Human Improved Recovery II
Enhancement: Human Versatility I
Enhancement: Human Versatility II
Enhancement: Human Versatility III
Enhancement: Human Versatility IV
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Improved Perform I
Enhancement: Fighter Strength I
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness I
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness II
Enhancement: Bard Wand and Scroll Mastery I
Enhancement: Bard Wand and Scroll Mastery II  

Since the xpac I dropped a fighter level to gain 15 bard.  This gave inspire heroics and access to inspire excellence.  Net loss was some hp really and that's about it.  Still trying to get the feat swapping right though, Fred is a pain to work with.  He's only missing overwhelming crit.  Picked up cleave/great cleave in exchange for some other feats.  I've very reluctant to LR him to fix everything I want to.  So we'll see how this ultimately pans out.

Primary casting bards I've always been ambivalent about.  Anything they can do a Wiz/Sorc does just as well or better.  So I focus on the song magic with a secondary strong utility.  Both of those build plans are not updated btw in reference to MOTD changes.  They were the springboards to start from.  But they should provide something to consider in your musings.  

My opinion has been that the changes in to hit brought on by the AC revamp dimish the utility of the warchanter by a large margin.  Spellsinger or Virtuoso are stronger choices as the game is now.

Spellsinger gives dc/sp/redux to parties.  1-2 less IC to parties compared to Warchanter.  More sp to work with, better healing options.

Warchanter gives higher inspired courage, access to medium armor proficiency.  Other songs have been rendered irrelevant unfortunately due to commonly acquired gear and new abilities available to most anyone.  Hell my Wizard can melee as a pure class these days 

I've yet to roll up a Virtuoso, but I understand other forumites have.  Perhaps they can clarify there.

NOTdarth wrote on Nov 8^th, 2012 at 4:51am:


You're welcome! 

It's actually a well proven concept. If you're looking for a fast TR life and then move on to another class, it's probably one of the faster ways of doing it.

If you're actually planning to stay as bard, there are many more better options.

NOTdarth wrote on Nov 8^th, 2012 at 8:59am:


Hi, Welcome! 

No, you've got to take Kopesh as a feat. It counts as an exotic weapon. Master's Touch is for simple and martial weapons plus shields.

I had a WC bard for a long time (just TRd him last night, as a matter of fact) that was 16bard/2fighter/2barb. He didn't really play like a bard, more like a barbarian with cool clickies. But after I got him an eSOS, I kinda stopped playing him. Dunno why. Possibly because I build a khopesh kensai and his DPS was way better.  He played obviously very different from my aforementioned SS bard. I'd say SS has a place and WC has a place. I liked the SS because the healing capabilities were much better than my old WC.


It's funny how the pendulum swings. For a long tome WC was the only bard, and SS sucked! Then epics came around and having the SS songs for SP cost reduction, SP regeneration and such were way more helpful in low-shrine quests (I'm looking at you, eCOF). I haven't played my bard much except in guild groups, but I haven't heard a lot of SS hate.

To answer Mo's question about the extra bard level whilst leveling solely for a PL feat, I don't think you gain that much more from it. Could be better for an extra fighter level. I did level a 16/2/2, but he was a 12/2/2 long before he was 16/2/2 so my perception may be a bit skewed.

Overall good advice in this thread, but if you want the best advice on a bard, make sure to stop by the official forums and ask LeslieWestMolestorGod. He is King of Bards.

rest wrote on Nov 8^th, 2012 at 4:48pm:

Tell me, a year ago when I sang vigor or trance there wasn't one Shroud or ToD without at least one comment how my 16 bard/2rog/2fighter khop singer sucks. But I don't play him much now either.

Exactly the same feats as your first build+khop.

TheFifthSock wrote on Nov 8^th, 2012 at 1:46am:

How fucking stupid is to pick toaster for class with blue bar and scroll hjealing ?

NOTdarth wrote on Nov 9^th, 2012 at 3:54am:



(I was being facetious, LeslieWest is a fucking idiot)

TheFifthSock wrote on Nov 9^th, 2012 at 10:33am:


I should have said pick toaster for bard, ergo no heal or reconstruct. So you want your cures and hjeal scrolls to be the most effective, right ?

I don't see anything bad there, but then again I haven't played a bard past level 7 or so.