ML really died when they got rid of Ninja. Even though you lot all seem to hate him he did a great job running it.

Kookie and Squeak tried their best but far too often Turbine were so far behind schedule they either rushed stuff through ML or skipped it entirely and Lamania was more up-to-date.

Kookie changed roles so didnt dedicate the same amount of time, and Squeak did her best but was probably too new to be brave enough to push for things MLers were saying.

The only way the PC will be different is if the Producers are serious about it. But even if they are serious about it, why werent they simply more serious about ML?

It makes zero sense to do what they are doing.

Unless maybe the truth of it is they simply werent interested in the views of most of the people who were left in ML when it was shut down. Sorry guys

Its Day 3 of the PC. Lets wait a month or 2 and see how things go when they are behind schedule and the Devs are complaining about the PC not liking any of their ideas.

It will be the same as ML in a short amount of time.

Arkat wrote on Feb 11^th, 2014 at 6:07pm:


I voted for the Hendricks choice, just because it amused me the most.

But I'd tend more towards the redshirts option, if trying for an actual choice.

HairyO wrote on Feb 11^th, 2014 at 5:17pm:


this

Cinamon please flav

You'll have to survive on Apple Pie, I don't know how to make Donuts.

To my mind the main reason to switch from Mournlands, which was a hybrid Alpha/Beta test server, to the Player's Council is the decision timing.

It has become abundantly clear that any development in DDO gets momentum and 9 times out of 10 it is too late to stop by the time it hits Lammania, and not enough content  was going via ML(or not being listened to - see below).

The key with the PC really working, is that Turbine run ideas past the council, not half developed code.  You can imagine that as a Developer you sink weeks/months into designing and many hundreds of hours having the coders bring it to life, only to have everyone say "that sucks balls".  You would be quite defensive, and absolutely not want to throw away months of work just because the ignorant player base doesn't know what is good for them (eg. secret door changes).

The real advantage is getting in early enough before people are too vested in concepts.  The feedback (if heeded) will allow Turbine to either abandon or modify concepts in the very early stages of development.

That is how it should be used.  Time will tell if it is.
I think some of the problems at Turbine are the devs going too far too soon, but my suspicion is that the producers and strategic decision makers were out of touch with the customers (players) and just as culpable.  Sure they need to make business focused decisions - no probs there, but some of the stuff is just really offensive blatant money making concepts.  Hence the Zynga derision that they have invited on themselves.  And some of the decisions leave me scratching my head wondering how they ever thought it was a good idea.

They still need a dedicated Beta test server, not a friggin "we can't change it now" preview server. 
And Alpha testing should be done in-house - you don't outsource Alpha testing - needs to be done by experienced professionals, not software users.

Meli wrote on Feb 12^th, 2014 at 6:06am:


I take your point, but in their shoes, I wouldn't care too much.  The risk is greater when you're floating half finished code, because if that leaks, you cannot change it enough.

An idea is just that.  You might float 100 ideas past the council, choose the best 20, knowing you can only deliver 10.  So leaks need to be managed, but if they happen, you just need to turn them to your advantage and use it to drive interest.
If the PC leaks, you investigate, cull it and eventually get rid of it if it persists.  There are ways to expose leaks too.

What you don't do is let that dipshit Glin anywhere near the forums to float his pearls of wisdom, before chuffing off home and watching the forums implode over the weekend.
In hindsight, I suspect it was all intentional as they weren't cubed or heavily moderated.  Some genius at Turbine thought it would be good to float the half baked ETR ideas on the forums.....
Outraged players are good aren't they? 

DropBear wrote on Feb 12^th, 2014 at 6:34am:


like missing the toilet when peeing?

DropBear wrote on Feb 12^th, 2014 at 6:23am:


Surely the best way to lessen the risk is just not to give anything of significance to ML or the PC? That way you don't have to worry about leaks. Sorted.

A lot of staff are players too. They are not totally out of touch with their own game.

I hope the leaks are sorted out because I would like the PC body to be useful. Early days yet to see. What I am really happy about with though is Lamm - especially if we continue to see feedback responded to.


blergh... /sleep

Methinks Turbine just needs a brilliant evil genius in their ranks... both to generate more income and make the game better.

If ever the gaming company would be sold, I'd definitely buy it. It wouldn't take that much to improve it all with a great team of programmers. I'd take care of my players, improve my servers, enhance the gaming experience, and just... DO WELL with it.

Any millionaires out there willing to help out with my brilliant plan?

Meli wrote on Feb 12^th, 2014 at 6:06am:


We will see Meli, I suspect Turbine knew the first few topics were going to bet leaked just to make sure everybody was aware of what they really could say and what is going to get them the boot, and that they are so far down the development plan that everybody will have forgotten about them when they actually hit Lammania.