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With ranged power incoming, I've been researching throwing builds. I know the conventional (Harhar's) wisdom is that you need rogue levels for shadow dodge and wizard levels for perma tenser's. With the incoming nerf/bugfix to Shadow Dodge, and the ability to scroll Tenser's, the Ninja capstone becomes very appealing (+2 DEX, +2 crit range, vorpal) This is what I'm leveling right now:

The Blender


Race: Elf
Alignment: Lawful Neutral
Class: 20 Monk


Stats:......... (36 pt build)

Strength............8
Dexterity...........20 (+ level ups)
Constitution.......10
Intelligence.........8
Wisdom.............18
Charisma............8
(+5 or better Dex and Wis tomes recommended)


Feat Progression

Level 1   : Point Blank Shot
Level 1(M):Shuriken Expertise
Level 2(M);Precision
Level 3   : Quickdraw
Level 6   : Rapid Shot
Level 6(M):10K Stars
Level 9   : Precise Shot
Level 12 : Improved Critical
Level 15 : Improved Precise Shot
Level 18 : Completionist
Level 21 : Overwhelming Critical
Level 24 : Great Dexterity
Level 26 : Holy Strike
Level 27 : Great Dexterity
Level 28 : Doubleshot



Enhancements

Ninja: 41 AP

Core 6/6
Sneak Attack Training 4/4 (8 pts)
Faster Sneaking 2/3 (4 pts)
Stealthy 3/3
Acrobatic 3/3
Agility 3/3
Sting of the Ninja (2 pts)
+1 DEX
+1 DEX
No Mercy 3/3 (6 pts)
Crippling Strike (2 pts)


Racial: 7 AP

Core 5/5 (7 pts)


Henshin: 8 AP

Core 1/6
Tortoise Form (2 pts)
Negotiator 2/3
Contemplation 3/3


Harper: 24 AP

Core 4/6 (DEX) (6 pts)
Harper Enchantment (2 pts)
Traveler's Toughness 2/3
Versatile Adept I 3/3
Versatile Adept II 3/3
Know the Angles 1/3
Highly Skilled 3/3
+1 DEX
+1 DEX


Shintao: 1 AP

Core 1/6



Epic Destiny: Shiradi Champion

Stay Frosty 2/2
+1 DEX

Pin 2/2
+1 DEX

Whirling Wrists 3/3
Otto's Whistler 2/2
+1 DEX

+1 DEX

Nerve Venom 3/3
+1 DEX

+1 DEX

Twists: 4/2/1/1

Sense Weakness
Damage Boost?
Rejuvenation Cocoon
Enlightenment


Dexterity:
20 base
5 tome
7 level
4 Wind Stance
11 gear
4 insight
1 exceptional
2 profane
2 completionist
2 epic feat
2 racial ap
4 Harper ap
2 NSpy ap
2 NSpy capstone
6 ED
=74 Standing

4 Tensors
2 ship
2 yugo
2 store pot
=84 Buffed

(+1) third epic dex feat
+4 twists
(+2) Upgrading to a +7 tome
=91 Theoretical Max Dex.

Wisdom:
18 base
5 tome
2 completionist
11 enhancement
2 insightful (augment)
2 profane
1 exceptional
=41 standing

2 guild ship
2 yugo
=45 buffed

´My plan is to use a build from a player on cannith who specifically does only ee as shuri throw build.
He runs in dreadnought only and build is 12 ranger 6 monk 2 palie drow.
Amazing build and perfoms extraordinarly good, only thing i will swap is from drow to halfling and throw in marks for more self sufficiency.
Overall, slaying shot got such a huge buff on shuri builds in this pass.
Not doing a build with that is imo pure madness, whatever ranged you pick you want ss

Il prolly try to do the regular monkcher base but shuri style, 12 6 2 monk ranger palie, and i assume it will be one of better shuri builds around.

Lelouch wrote on Mar 24^th, 2015 at 4:20am:


Too bad there's not enough AP for ninja capstone and AA tier 5. I'd rather max out dex for extra tosses than hit a long ass cooldown shot once in a while anyway.

I ran this build on lammania through ToEE solo on EE for about 15 mins and just shredded everything I came across.

5 Foot Step wrote on Mar 24^th, 2015 at 4:23am:


Two free feats. Screw the build points on con, the back-end buffs for hit points make it redundant and Your running a ranged toon you don't need toe to toe numbers.

5 Foot Step wrote on Mar 24^th, 2015 at 4:23am:


Also drop the points in henshin and put them in Drow, get +2 dex, 2 levels of Xen'drik Weapon Training for +2 to hit and damage with shurikens, and Darkfire which currently works on everything including undead.

If your worried about the con still, use the two feats for tough, but seriously there are so many ways to bump HP now it's insane.

Grand wrote on Mar 24^th, 2015 at 5:02am:


I'm not worried about the con, but I'd rather have it than trade it for nothing. +2 damage  If I had more points they would go in harper for ranged power. +1%>+1

Oh, and contemplation is just there for running the epic alacrity quiver.

5 Foot Step wrote on Mar 24^th, 2015 at 5:17am:


If you not worried about the con, then darkfire and the +2 to hit and damage are much better buys than the elf. also contemplation is not worth it, espeically since your having to buy negotiation to get to it. Keep the 1 shinto, but dont spend the points in Heshin, on the build your making it's a waste of points.

So if you cant see the benefit of the +2 attack +2 damage, just drop 6 points in drow for dex and put the rest into harper. But keep in mind that ranged power has a much smaller impact on shuriken due to the small front end. So the +2 damage per star is going to be more.

Revisit the shuriken expertise, the strength of a chucker is VOLUME not large front end, you must take expertise otherwise you are neutering your dps, plain and simple. And if your running in shiradi???? that is all about volume, more shots=more procs.

Since Shiradi is becoming a strong ranged destiny, it might be interesting if you can mix in some caster stuff in a sort of hybrid.

E.g., quickened maximized MM/CM SLAs. 

But as shuriken DPS is getting a buff, I suspect that would just be a DPS loss.  Which, considering shiradi was used as a caster destiny before, is really pretty sad state for casters if you think about it. 

Also, dont see carchery, i mean it is a nice increase in dps.
Unless, it of course doesnt work with throwers..
Again..

Also i think putting more points into int for better kta would be better overall.

I just am not sold on pure monk.
You can get killer and free feats /sp rams with ranger.
You can get saves from palie for blanket immunity.
You get some nice benefits from rogue, still worth taking.

Pure monk just seems like the worst option to me.
I would actually entirely skip on 10 k and focus on high dshoot.
Thats why i prefer aa tree, costs crap load ap but the last core alone is to good

Also keep in mind that you can do some odd thrower builds with barb, yes sounds dumb, better for repeti builds, but criti rage is borked when you use it on ranged.

I just see so many better options out there and personally will prolly do something entirely different.

This feels like uhm harr vs firewall xD
Firewall after pure, harr after hybrids.
And we know whose builds were better

From people who play ee specifically on thrower builds, i got confirmation that almost every single one of them is running dreadnought atm, and a friend tested on lama and said its defacto the best dest for shuris now. Keep that in mind

After a number of thrower builds I'm honestly not feeling pure monk anymore. Monks were so survivable compared to everything else when I played my first Shuricannon. But I just did an SDK Bard thrower so it had wings for 11 ap instead of abundant step and abused the shit out of Harmonic Resonance.

Ninja Spy capstone was awesome. Vorpal on ranged can be had on gear now.

Mountain Stance was awesome, now there's Holy Sword and SB. 15 Pally/3 Monk could get double shuriken expertise and since that part of the T3 Ninja Spy works when uncentered you could still run Heavy Armor and laugh at everything like Pallies do these days.

On the other end, Slayer Arrows are great, but I'm not drinking the kool-aid just yet. Maybe I should run them again to be sure, but I didn't miss them this life. However, it's not fair to call it all complete crap on the way to unlock them. With the volume on a shuriken build paralyzing st- I mean arrows start working, even in EE Stormhorns.

I'm personally pretty moody with builds and admit I'm not totally rational. What I play is heavily influence by what I just played. The big annoyance for me this life was scrolling Tensor's. I felt like I was taking my foot off the gas too much so my next build will probably try to get full or near full BaB without scrolling, which won't be worth building for to some people.

I think thrower builds in U25 will be a question of what else they do besides throwing. We know the limit on tosses/sec. What's the next thing that defines the build? Ranged CDG? The option to Furyshot? Traditional 10k/Manyshot rotation? Faceroll level saves and PRR/MRR? All of which brings me back to moving away from pure monk.

5 Foot Step wrote on Mar 24^th, 2015 at 4:48am:


Obvious miss is tomes, after that just some theory dex:

20 base
5 tome
7 level
4 Wind Stance
11 gear
4 insight
1 exceptional
2 profane
2 completionist
2 epic feat
2 racial ap
4 Harper ap
2 NSpy ap
2 NSpy capstone
68

4 Tensors
2 ship
2 yugo
2 store pot
78

(+1) third epic dex feat
6 ed
3 twist
(+1) Upgrading to a +6 tome
89 Total Dex.

Grand wrote on Mar 24^th, 2015 at 7:41pm:


You keep bringing up 2 feats. I only see one, Shuriken Expertise.

Shuriken Proficiency would be the other, but that is auto granted via monk levels.

What am I missing?

Munkenmo wrote on Mar 24^th, 2015 at 8:34pm:


Two feats by being a Drow, where he goes from there class wise for granted feats is a secondary issue, as chuckers no longer have to be monks to be viable, but they do have to be Drow before Elf or you are gimping out the gate (Elf AA withstanding of course, that changes things) Five doesn't have a firm handle of the chucker basics, which is fine everyone starts somewhere, but arrow deflect as rational? WTF?