12 rogue, 8 monk for Henshin Thief Acrobat. The rest.. others can figure out!

platfarmchink wrote on Dec 10^th, 2017 at 4:08pm:


oh fuck thats right.. so uh. 12r/6m/2d.. if you want bear ofc

Arganthonius wrote on Dec 10^th, 2017 at 6:32pm:


Monk and Rogue both have options in trees to use Dex for staffs.. you really are silly XD

If you wernt going to take rogue for the insane speed boost while staff wielding (no really, its freaking insane how fast a thief acrobat can swing their sticks), you would drop 6 points into Ninja Spy to gain Dexterity to Hit and Dmg while Centered, otherwise.. just take the rogue thief acrobat stuff, cuz they are required to get Kip-Up, which makes you immune to just about everything movement impairing. Both the Staff Control/Stick Fighting (rogue) and Basic Ninja Training/Advanced Ninja Training (monk) do the same sorta thing, cept Rogues applies only to Staffs, where as Monks applies to literally anything you can hold in y our hands, and remain centered with.

Probably 20 monk?

http://www.ddovault.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1491936091/1#1

Arganthonius wrote on Dec 10^th, 2017 at 6:39pm:


Oh.. you thought the Druid bit wasnt a joke.. even with the hilarious Gif Attachment.. My bad.. carry on not getting it ^-^

Arganthonius wrote on Dec 10^th, 2017 at 6:45pm:


Im not sure what you talkin bout here.. CoF never gave Crit multi, that I remember at least, and Wiki also doesnt know:

Description: Fire Ki Spell-Like ability: You expend 30 ki to will flame into the world around you. Enemies around you take 2d6 fire damage every 2 seconds, increasing by an additional 2d6 damage every 2 seconds that you remain standing in the flames. This damage scales with 2x Melee Power. If you leave the area of the flames, this effect ends. A successful reflex save (DC 10 + monk level, + Wisdom modifier + Stunning Bonuses) reduces damage by half. While wielding a quarterstaff inside your Cauldron of Flame, you gain +20 PRR, +10 MRR, and +15% Dodge that ignores Dodge Cap.

all CoF did, was literally made you a walking fireball.

In total, a Monk can get a total of: +7 to hit and +9 dmg from tree to qst

A Rogue/Monk can get: +11 to hit and +15 to dmg w/qst, as well as an additional 10 melee power on the tier 5 +3 to-hit/dmg enhancement towards everything melee oriented.


~edit~ forgot, both can take tier 5 +1 crit multiplier, and threat range increase enhancements at lvl 12~

~Edit 2~ Did now however take into note the additional Melee power obtained from Henshin cores.. thats a net loss of 35 Melee Power from a Pure.. MP fucked everything when it came out.. I would have to actually roll each build, and see which performed better now that MP is a factor in things.

Arganthonius wrote on Dec 10^th, 2017 at 7:15pm:


Right.. hms.. interesting.. Pure might actually pull ahead due to the MP gain from the last 3 cores then..

Hi there, DDO is hurd. Can u pls build my toon and level me up pls?

The pure monk will likely be more DPS, especially if you build for the melee power.

Another thing to consider is defenses.  A pure monk build should have a significant advantage in defense over a rogue icon.  15% faster runspeed, AC, saves, Shadow Veil, slightly better self healing, better wings, etc.  If I remember correctly, you can get >50% standing dodge in gm water stance.

If you're planning on running a melee in anything above 1-skull reaper, you have to build for solid defenses just as much as you do for DPS.  You'll want as much AC, PRR, dodge cap and other damage avoidance options as you can squeeze in.

The downsides to pure monk are the lack of trapping and that you have to hit 20 before you the passive 15% attack speed bonus from the Henshin capstone.  Rogue splashes get that same 15% bonus with 2 levels of rogue so they get to enjoy it for 18 more levels than a monk.

Digimonk wrote on Dec 11^th, 2017 at 4:11pm:


You cant rule out the Rogues natural gain of Sneak Attack dice, which is a given in like.. 99% of content.

18 monk < 14 rogue is a no brainer, only a 20 monk will out dps a rogue monk splash, due to the capstone.

Digimonk wrote on Dec 12^th, 2017 at 12:31am:


except we talking here about a splash build which is usually 14rog/6monk and has most of the defenses that a pure monk gets w/ rogues natural defenses.

Korvel wrote on Dec 12^th, 2017 at 5:48am:


Let me know if there are any points of Dexterity I missed.. I feel as though it should be breaking 100.. almost hitting 110 even. Hms.

Good question. Taking purely theoreticals here, since every player is different, so are less or more likely to be able to micro manage various gear swaps to maintain max Dexterity possible (something around 130 now i hear.. just insanes XD) Lets break down that first, so we can see what our to-hit/dmg bonus looks like:

20 Base
+7 Level-up
+7 Tome
+4 Class Enhancements
+2 Racial Enhancements
+4 Harper Enhancements
+4 Ultimate Air Stance
+2 Racial PL Feats for Elf and Halfling
+2 Completionist Feat
+17 Item Enhancement Bonus (Item) (Been seeing +20 is a thing now? fuck I need to get on and play more if this is the case.. )
+8 Insightful(Item, Random loot (Legendary Greensteel +7 max)
+2 Exceptional(Legendary Greensteel)
+4 Quality Item
+2 Artifact (Legendary Slave Lords Might Set)
+2 Guild Airship Buffs
+4 Alchemical Tenser's Transformation
+2 Yugoloth
+3* Sentient Jewel
Total: 94 sustainable Dexterity.. not all that much higher than when I was still around, currently can hit 86 on my Shuri. not bad. anyhow.. This can be attained by both the pure Monk, and the Rogue/Monk splashes. (Possibly 2 less on the pure, unless you put points into Ninja as well, which you will need to to gain the Dex to hit/dmg anyhow.)

Next, we take a look at sneak attack dice, and feat options available to the Rogue 14, that are not available to rogue 2/pure monk variants:

Pure Monk can obtain a total of 4d6 SA, through tier 1 to 4 Ninja Spy tree, T5 is a stretch, unless you sacrifice some melee power from harper.

2 rogue, gains an additional 1d6, but loses tier 4 from ninja to compensate for taking tier 1 for faster attack speed in Thief Acrobat. However, will still have to spend 5 points into Ninja, because 3 rogue is needed to not waste points on the same core 1 ability twice. for a total of 4d6 SA.

14/6 Rogue Gains an additional 6d6 from levels, but will lose the 4d6 from ninja to take full advantage of Thief Acrobat tree. Standard 7d6 from Class SA as a total. Defensively, a 10 or higher rogue, gains the option of taking Defensive Roll, which allows you a chance, equal to your Reflex save, to take half dmg while at a certain HP threshold. Due to it being a Dex based build, with almost 100 Dexterity, we have almost a 45 bonus to reflex saves, just from Dex. Not including +10 item, Greater Heroism, Haste, and other goodies. IE: Once at, or under, 50% hp, you will likely always take half dmg.. cuz yay Reflex .


~New Additions - +6 from Sentient Jewls, if you really wished to do it that way.. Otherwise:
1: Spines of the Manticore: Dexterity
2: Spines of the Manticore: Attack and Damage
3: The Long Shadow: Dexterity
4: The Long Shadow: Attack and Damage
5: The Long Shadow: Melee Power
6: Sucker Punch: Melee Power
7: Sucker Punch: Dexterity

Set Bonus: Manticore 2 set +2 dmg; Shadow 2 and 3 set +5 Melee/Ranged Power, +4d6 +(1d6*Epic Level) Acid dmg per hit; Sucker Punch 2 set +5 Melee Power