broken?

So the question I have that no one's really addressed...


What happened to Glin?

Rushing to another Expansion
Increased Level cap without the content to support it
Iconics as a draw for FR fans new to this F2P game that they want them to pay up front for.
Enhancement Pass
Maj referred to "the amount of stupid in the past year"
Rushed Shipdates whether content was ready or not

I'm assuming he's ultimately responsible, and just curious if he got flogged, sacked, or failed upwards...

rest wrote on Jul 2^nd, 2013 at 7:50pm:


yup i think he meant broken.

GreyMouser wrote on Jul 1^st, 2013 at 10:20pm:


Sorry, but those surveys don't work too well on a "mature" product that needs growth - yet is trendings downwards. People just hanging on won't fill them out since they are jaded that change won't happen. You mainly have fanbois filling them out and  very few that actually still care about the game enough to post negative feedback and hoping someone actually takes it to heart.


You guys need to watch some of those Kitchen Nightmare shows. You know, the one where they go back to ex-customers, examine their needs, and then pound it into the skulls of the owners.

It is funny to see the new guy say how he liked old style D&D, yet each of these changes (secret door rolls  ) gets it even farther away from any resemblances to D&D.  You are actually making this more like NeverWinter - which will kick your ass in the market of "D&D by name and lore only".

GreyMouser wrote on Jul 1^st, 2013 at 10:20pm:

You talking about the real game?

Being proud about fixing 8000 bugs in this game is like being proud of using a machine gun to kill termites... how much more damage did your fixes cause?

The Surveys are also too focused. Alright, you asked our least favorite 3 enhancements and most liked 3 enhancements... where's the section about the general system? What if I think it's fucktarded that Radiant Servants having an aura, Warchanters using Medium armor, Tempests dual wielding, etc are tier 5 enhancements instead of CORE Enhancements since, ya know, really, those are why people take a prestige.

The Cores are already level gated, and you have the code to lock out one capstone (though I think you may just rely on 42 AP >50% total to achieve it)...

Move the "Iconic" features to the core enhancement tree, lock out core enhancement trees to 1 per class, change points in tree to total points spent so people can cherry-pick the enhancements they want for their characters and the system might become workable.

At the moment the "points spent in tree" mechanic just ensures homogenized pieces of crap for each class. Spellsingers can spend 65 AP maximum in the tree, 85% are going to pick the same 42 AP to get to the capstone. This is not build diversity.


It's fucktarded that the with the new enhancement pass the best "raid healer" is going to be 15 Druid/5 Cleric with an aura and throwing Mass vigors. It's fucktarded that the level 12 abilities of most classes have been moved to the capstone. It's fucktarded that racial pres now have a 14 point investment to unlock them. There is so much fail in the current design...  You can't be surprised that the players keep asking "do you even play your game?"

Oh, and Heroic Durability giving xp on 5 level splits is counter to the rest of the game. Increase base hp per level. Making 18/2 splits will be punished in both BAB (and thus PRR) and HP now.... Yaaa, more compound scaling that Turbine never understands.

Memnir wrote on Jul 6^th, 2013 at 1:28pm:


I will agree, and I'm going to be honest I have hope MajMal friend is going to reverse the last few years of shitty stuff that has been done to our DDO.

The Enhancement Crash should have been an UI update only. I proved it was possible, and without any system change ( or minimal ones ) it wouldn't have taken long and it wouldn't broken anything. ( as UI has basically no impact on game logic. )

I don't think the devs ever played D&D on PnP or even tried get some background on what they were working on. They have cookie cutter things they learned works and they want to apply them on DDO.

Except that they don't understand that DDO is not a cookie cutter MMO, It's Dungeons and Dragons Online... It's carrying the name of the game that basically created the Roleplaying Game genre, that was then used as Adventure Games on computers, that was then corrupted by the Japanese into RPG on consoles, that was then brought back as RPG on Pcs and when the technology allowed became MMORPGs.

raybob wrote on Jul 6^th, 2013 at 9:34pm:

My guess,  they're getting it from a bloody rectum.

raybob wrote on Jul 6^th, 2013 at 9:34pm:


Data from surveys...

The fanbois and those that have builds that will benefit form the Enhancement Crash didn't bother to post but did fill out the survey...

And the way the survey are made has also an impact, you can twist numbers generated by a survey in such a way that everything seems to be sunny even when it's all black.

The survey we have for the Enhancement Crash can be easily twisted to show that everybody likes it in nice graphs, as most of the important things is in adlib boxes ( what you like the best, what you dislike the most, what change you'd like, ... )
Manglement don't care about adlib boxes, they want nice powerpoints with shiny graphs, and these will come from the few checkboxes/multiple choice questions from the survey, as they are
unimportant ( for us ) [ like which tree you prefer, which tree you hate ] the survey shows that everybody likes the Enhancement Crash, despite the fact that a huge majority of the forum posters hates it. And after a quick survey in my guild, most of the people don't care about it, as they know anything they try will not have any impact on it, it's going to be forced down our throat even if we don't want it... Some will quit if it breaks their chars, others will just TR and do something else, that's the only sure thing I got from the chats. The only sure thing is that it wouldn't bring more people.

And yes I also asked to those that are exploring NWO while waiting for the Crash to happen, as quite a few went that way when the Crash was announced along with the Expansion, that's something Turbine has not taken into account : That people are so fed up with fubared things and half arsed ideas that they just left for greener pastures while waiting to see how fucked up things are... then they might eventually come back or stay where they all went.

Flav wrote on Jul 7^th, 2013 at 3:46am:

Why would I do that? QA makes things look rosy. I'm not Colin Powell at the UN....

Arkat wrote on Jul 7^th, 2013 at 10:34am:


mouser, this is about right, and it wouldn't be your fault, it would actually be more of a despite everything you have done.


Really have felt pretty shit on by Turbine, and whomever has been doing a rotten job of running the place. I think mostly, what we are all expecting to happen is you are going to release this in an unfinished, half working state, like each and every other new addition to the game since u9 or so.

The real fear isn't the actual changes, the real fear is that the changes are going to either BE feather_of_sun'ed/unfinished on release, or they will break/remain unfinished after.

Somebody over there has spent a lot of time shooting you guys in the foot. Toss in the over the top heavy handed moderation and forgive us for being cynics.


Edit: I don't think you will hear anybody say that you personally haven't listened to us. You are the only one we think DOES listen to us. we generalize 'you' to mean everyone at Turbine but you in most cases.

I also myself somehow in my head also mistake you for a grand messenger to them as well,  and I know even if you were it wouldn't matter because they have never given a shit before, so the feeling is why would they now?

GreyMouser wrote on Jul 7^th, 2013 at 10:23am:


There's lots of reasons, but I don't expect you to do it, I was just generally speaking, as the manglement fad of the moment is KPI and Powerpoint Manglement.... and if you've working in industry long eonugh you know that you can make KPI ( and surveys ) say whatever you want them to say by careful selection of the data. Especially once it ends up on a shiny Powerpoint.

Arkat wrote on Jul 7^th, 2013 at 10:34am:


This is the big point.
While it is nothing personal as you have been the only Turbine person that came out and actually talked to us and tried to explain us why things where so bad, you're just one person in an organization that has screwed us over and over again during the last few years by not listening to us.

Quote:


No but my fucking mouse does. One day you will see. It will happen to you too.

Quote:


Given they never release anything "finished" its an easy statement for them to make.

There will be bugs and flaws on launch, and then a patch will come along to fix a whole bunch of them, while breaking a whole bunch of others. None of it will have been properly tested anywhere. Then there will be another patch which fixes more bugs and flaws while creating more bugs and flaws.

Then they will move on to new stuff because they cant linger any longer. Like the comment about not going back and fixing old content (in response to a question on Epic Combat Archery - apparently this is too old to fix now).

Or, I will be pleasantly surprised when they release a polished product.