2nd lifer so I was spread thin on build points. Barely managed to get OC and ISA.

Human, didn't consider FoP but I reckon I could've fit it in.

PA, C, GC, OC, IC:B, Dodge, Mobility, full THF+perfect, ISA, Master Stance, Precision, Imp Evasion, Opportunist.

If you want I can be arsed run it through the chargen again to point what I picked out when.

aDifferentHandle wrote on Oct 27^th, 2013 at 8:15pm:


ok... math incoming. 

This is assuming a Horc Strength build, 13R/6M/1D taking the relevant 2 handed or 2 weapon feat line.  Assuming perfect 2WF, perfect 2 handed fighting, overwhelming critical, improved SA, master of forms, and the appropriate improved critical. Assuming Dreadnaught with +6 critical, Imp PA, and devastating critical.  All calculations were made using average die rolls for weapon damage and sneak attack. I figured this without buffs(other then haste/feat/speed 15 item).

2HF calcs
Base speed Sireth Qstaff=86.5 swings/min.
+15% TA and +15% haste=113.2985 SPM

Doublestrike assuming black dragon set 3% (3.3989 SPM), perfect 2wf 5%(5.6649 SPM), opportunist 3%(3.3989) and quickstrike 25% for 80% of attacks.(22.6597 spm)=35.1224 doublestrike hits per min.

113.2985 + 35.1224=148.4209 mainhand attacks/min

Weapon damage
3.5d10+8 base(or 27.25 avg damage/swing) (Imp PA +.5)
+30 str(assumes a +20 mod or 50 Str)
+16 PA
+16 Staff or 2 handed enhancements
+10 deadly
+4 planar prowess
+103.25 average unbuffed damage/swing

Sneak attack damage
7d6 rogue(24.5)
1d6 ninja(3.5)
Imp SA (10.5)
+13 from SA 5 and Exc SA 3
+2 deception 1 item
53.5 average SA damage/swing

Crit profile (running earth master of forms)
13-18 x3(360.75 dmg)
19-20 x6(721.5 dmg)
Seeker 6, Dreadnaught seeker 6, and exc seeker5= +17

supreme good adds 10.5 avg dmg a hit. 140.9998 hits *10.5=1480 damage.
cloudburst adds 100 lightening and 75 sonic damage per hit on a natural 20.  7.4201 hits*175=1298 damage
Red slot adds 5.5 damage of your elemental choice per hit. 140.9998 hits *5.5=775 damage
lightening strike adds 610 avg damage on 1.5% of hits. 2.2263 hits *610=1358 damage
1480+1298+775+1358=4911 damage from procs


So...  assuming misses on 1, always confirming crits, always sneaking, not counting glancing blows(witch do currently work on normal attacks, but not cleaves), or grazing; we have
5% misses (7.4210 swings)
55% normal - 81.6314 swings@103.25 dmg=8428 dmg over a minute
30% low crits - 44.5262 swings@ 360.75 dmg=16062 dmg over a minute
10% high crits  - 14.8420 swings @ 721.5 dmg=10708 dmg over a minute.
95% SA damage - 140.9998 swings@53.5 dmg=7543 dmg over a minute.
subtotal=42741
misc effects=4911
total=47652 damage/minute or 794 Damage Per Second

2WF damage calcs
Base speed dual Celestia 2WF =86.66 SPM
+15% haste=102.21 SPM

Doublestrike assuming black dragon set 3% (3.0663 SPM), perfect 2wf 5%(5.1105 SPM), opportunist 3%(3.0663)= 11.2431 doublestrike attacks/min
102.21 + 11.2431=113.4531 mainhand swings/min
Offhand assuming G2WF and perfect 2WF(90%)=91.989 offhand swings/min

Mainhand Damage(dual Celestia)
3d10+8(24.5 avg damage)(Imp PA +.5)
+20 Str
+8 PA
+10 deadly
+4 prowess
66.5 avg unbuffed damage

Offhand damage
3d10+8(24.5 avg damage)(Imp PA +.5)
+10 Str
+8 PA
+10 deadly
+4 prowess
56.5 avg unbuffed damage

Sneak attack damage
7d6 rogue(24.5)
4d6 ninja(14)
4d6 assassin (14)
Imp SA (10.5)
+13 from SA 5 and Exc SA 3
+2 deception 1 item
78 average SA damage/swing

Crit profile (running earth master of forms)
17-18 x2(167 dmg main/147 offhand)
19-20 x5(417.5 dmg main/367.5 offhand)
Seeker 6, Dreadnaught seeker 6, and exc seeker5= +17

supreme good adds 10.5 avg dmg a hit. 195.1669 hits *10.5=2049 damage
greater Sunburst adds an unknown amount of damage, estimating 15d6 or 52.5 damage a hit  Estimating a 5% proc rate(correct me if i'm wrong here)20.5542 hits*52.5=1078 damage
fiery detonation adds 52.5 damage per vorpal hit, 1/2 damage on a DC 39 reflex. 10.2721 hits(assuming all vorpals confirm) for 52.5 damage(all saves fail)=539 damage
Radiance adds 14 avg damage on a crit and blinds.  41.0884 hits *14=575 damage
Misc damage total 2049+1078+539+575= 4241 damage/min

So...  assuming misses on 1, always confirming crits, always sneaking, not counting grazing; we have on the
Mainhand
5% misses (5.6726 swings)
75% normal - 85.0898 swings@ 66.5 dmg=5658 dmg over a minute
10% low crits - 11.3453 swings@ 167 dmg=1894  dmg over a minute
10% high crits - 11.3453 swings @ 373.75dmg=4736 dmg over a minute.
95% SA damage - 107.7804 swings@ 78 dmg=8406 dmg over a minute.
total damage/min=20694 mainhand damage a minute
Offhand
5% misses (4.5994 swings)
75% normal - 68.9917 swings@ 56.5 dmg=3898 dmg over a minute
10% low crits - 9.1989 swings@ 147 dmg=1352 dmg over a minute
10% high crits - 9.1989 swings @ 367.5 dmg=3380 dmg over a minute.
95% SA damage - 87.3895 swings@ 78 dmg=6186 dmg over a minute.
total damage/min=14816 offhand damage a minute

subtotal 20694 + 14816=35510
Misc damage = 4241
total = 39751 damage per minute(662 damage per second)


Wraps DPS
Base speed EE thunder and lightening unarmed =93.23 SPM
+15% haste=115.0575 SPM

Doublestrike assuming black dragon set 3% (3.4517 SPM), perfect 2wf 5%(5.7528 SPM), opportunist 3%(3.4547)= 12.6562 doublestrike attacks/min.
115.0575 + 12.6562= 127.7137 mainhand swings/min

Offhand assuming G2WF and perfect 2WF(90%)=103.5517 offhand swings/min

Mainhand Damage
4d6+7(21 avg damage)(RF fists)(Imp PA +.5)(using thunder and lightening)
+20 Str
+8 PA
+10 deadly
+4 prowess
63 avg unbuffed damage

Offhand damage
4d6+7(21 avg damage)(RF fists)(Imp PA +.5)(using thunder and lightening)
+20 Str
+8 PA
+10 deadly
+4 prowess
63 avg unbuffed damage

Crit profile (running earth master of forms)
19-20 x4(320 dmg main/320 offhand)
Seeker 6, Dreadnaught seeker 6, and exc seeker5= +17


Thunder adds 21 average average per hit. 209.7021*21=4613 damage
lightening adds 21 average damage a hit. 209.7021*21=4613 damage
Red slot adds 5.5 damage a hit of your elemental flavor.  209.7021*5.5=1208 damage
Misc total damage=10434

So...  assuming misses on 1, always confirming crits, always sneaking, not counting grazing; we have on the
Mainhand
5% misses (6.3856 swings)
85% normal - 108.5566 swings@ 63 dmg=6839 dmg over a minute
10% crits - 12.7713 swings @ 320 dmg=4086 dmg over a minute.
95% SA damage - 121.328 swings @ 78 dmg=9463 dmg over a minute.
total damage/min=20388 mainhand damage a minute
Offhand
5% misses (5.1775 swings)
85% normal - 88.0189 swings@ 63 dmg=5545 dmg over a minute
10% crits - 10.3551 swings @ 320 dmg=3313 dmg over a minute.
95% SA damage - 98.3741 swings @ 78 dmg=7673 dmg over a minute.
total damage/min=16471 mainhand damage a minute

subtotal 20388 + 16471=36859
Misc damage = 10434
total = 47293 damage per minute(788 damage per second)

https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/275144-Vanshilar-s-Attack-Speed-Index-...
* Alacrity bonuses add together when they stack
* Fast THF (greataxe, quarterstaff) swings per minute (BAB 20) is 86.50 * (100% + 1.0327 * sum of each boost%)
* TWF swings per minute (BAB 20) is 86.66 * (100% + 1.1965 * sum of each boost%) (note TWF gets about 20% more than THF from each percentage of boost)
* Unarmed (monk) swings per minute (BAB 20) is 93.23 * (100% + 1.2939 * sum of each boost%)

Tyrsis wrote on Nov 2^nd, 2013 at 2:09pm:


I never said staves are shit damage.

Tyrsis wrote on Nov 2^nd, 2013 at 2:09pm:

At a glance:
Quickstrike has a 10second duration with a 20second cooldown, it's at best 50% of your attacks, not 80%

Relating to unarmed you've missed :
a 10% boost to off hand attacks in shintao tier 1
wraps base damage = 1d8 enhancement with shintao tier 5.

You've biased this in such a way that it's a best case scenario for a staff user vs twf but once you fix your quickstrike calc staves are still behind wraps, before you even add to your twf calcs.

Factoring in effects like sense weakness will push wraps further ahead of staves too.

Munkenmo wrote on Oct 27^th, 2013 at 8:34pm:


Close enough.

Tyrsis wrote on Nov 2^nd, 2013 at 8:46pm:


Yes it does.

your the guy who's axered up the most favorable conditions for 1/4 staves, which still lose.

In summary though:

Against bosses wraps still win.
Against trash wraps win significantly (thanks entirely to stunning fist)
6% moral bonus from any doublestrike item significanly boosts wraps in your calcs.

Staves have come a long way, but the unoptimal wraps build you listed, still beats out an optimised staff build.

Thus my point earlier:

Munkenmo wrote on Oct 27^th, 2013 at 3:02pm:

Quote:


Well, not quite. only 6 seeker is pretty moderate. 10 seeker would be more beneficial to a qstaff user than to a handwrap user.
ISA offers more extra damage to Handwraps than to a Qstaff.

Some of the attacks do proc glancing blows, which was deliberately ignored in the first wall of text.

It's interesting to see that QStaves are not that far behind Handwraps.

I thought empty hand mastery did not affect wolf form?

Munkenmo wrote on Nov 3^rd, 2013 at 3:07pm:

What split would you do for a fighter past life on a toon who wants to use sticks?

Munkenmo wrote on Nov 4^th, 2013 at 5:13am:



I can back this. Shizz was ridic!

Munkenmo wrote on Nov 4^th, 2013 at 5:13am:

Do I understand it correctly, that, while technically wielding a quarterstaff, the only thing which migrates from human form to wolf form are the weapon effects, but not crit profile, glancing blows and base damage?

Munkenmo wrote on Nov 5^th, 2013 at 5:26am:

Just the info if you get +1[w], or the actual weapon dice as well? (like 1.5[2d4] from Theurgic Stave, which is not made of wood, but has an interesting weapon dice. ).