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Very Hot Topic (More than 75 Replies) SWF Paladin (Read 53315 times)
Kluege
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SWF Paladin
Oct 6th, 2014 at 2:50pm
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Was thinking of a 19 Paladin / 1 FVS Human build that uses swf and an orb.  1 FVS is for magical training and DM use from spell points, but mostly to save the feat.  Any thoughts of how this would work out?

I need some advice on feats.  I am thinking this so far:

3x swf, 2x shield mastery, precision, imp healing, OC.

I am not sure if vanguard bonuses to "with shield equipped" works with an orb so...  kind of wanted to know before I get too far into this.

Thx
« Last Edit: Oct 6th, 2014 at 2:50pm by Kluege »  
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Rubbinns
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Re: SWF Paladin
Reply #1 - Oct 6th, 2014 at 3:00pm
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http://www.ddovault.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1407963021/68#68

Magical training isn't needed. I was under that impression on lama that I needed to take it, but I was wrong.
« Last Edit: Oct 6th, 2014 at 3:00pm by Rubbinns »  

Mockduck wrote on Aug 30th, 2010 at 2:20pm:
I don't think naming names would be a good thing for me to do, but I'd pretty much add anyone who's a know-it-all dick on the list.� Even if they are sometimes intelligent with their opinions, the way they state them in long, "i'm a lawyer at trial"-type posts makes me want to punch them in the face.� They act like whiney babies with god complexes and then freak out if someone so much as breathes criticism in their direction.
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Kluege
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Re: SWF Paladin
Reply #2 - Oct 6th, 2014 at 3:20pm
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Rubbinns wrote on Oct 6th, 2014 at 3:00pm:
http://www.ddovault.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1407963021/68#68

Magical training isn't needed. I was under that impression on lama that I needed to take it, but I was wrong.


Just so I know... how is it not required?  Do you get magical training for free later in the game?
  
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Re: SWF Paladin
Reply #3 - Oct 6th, 2014 at 5:00pm
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Kluege wrote on Oct 6th, 2014 at 3:20pm:
Just so I know... how is it not required?  Do you get magical training for free later in the game?

No. Just equip an orb.
  

Mockduck wrote on Aug 30th, 2010 at 2:20pm:
I don't think naming names would be a good thing for me to do, but I'd pretty much add anyone who's a know-it-all dick on the list.� Even if they are sometimes intelligent with their opinions, the way they state them in long, "i'm a lawyer at trial"-type posts makes me want to punch them in the face.� They act like whiney babies with god complexes and then freak out if someone so much as breathes criticism in their direction.
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Kluege
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Re: SWF Paladin
Reply #4 - Oct 6th, 2014 at 5:01pm
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Ok, so the requirement just goes away when I am epic level 1?
  
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gibbon
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Re: SWF Paladin
Reply #5 - Oct 6th, 2014 at 5:04pm
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Vanguard doesn't work with orbs. At least, To the Fore and Shield Specialization icons drop off when you switch to an orb. This was on a fighter who had magical training.

Bashes worked on orbs pre-23 but I didn't test that.

I'm wondering if it might be worth it to take the level 18 core of Vanguard, the THF line, and run B-word sword and shield. You'd end up with half the combat speed bonus of SWF but glancing blows and shield bashes. Feats get tight as hell if you want shield feats though.
  
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Kluege
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Re: SWF Paladin
Reply #6 - Oct 6th, 2014 at 5:08pm
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Also, what parts of vanguard work with an orb?  Do you get all the benefits of sheild specialization?  Does Missile shield work? What things do not work?
  
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Kluege
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Re: SWF Paladin
Reply #7 - Oct 6th, 2014 at 5:10pm
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gibbon wrote on Oct 6th, 2014 at 5:04pm:
Vanguard doesn't work with orbs. At least, To the Fore and Shield Specialization icons drop off when you switch to an orb. This was on a fighter who had magical training.

Bashes worked on orbs pre-23 but I didn't test that.

I'm wondering if it might be worth it to take the level 18 core of Vanguard, the THF line, and run B-word sword and shield. You'd end up with half the combat speed bonus of SWF but glancing blows and shield bashes. Feats get tight as hell if you want shield feats though.


Ok, so realistically, the build is 18 pally and 2 something... maybe fighter for feats or monk for evasion and stance?  Or is pure pally beneficial?
« Last Edit: Oct 6th, 2014 at 5:11pm by Kluege »  
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Re: SWF Paladin
Reply #8 - Oct 6th, 2014 at 6:16pm
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Kluege wrote on Oct 6th, 2014 at 5:10pm:
Ok, so realistically, the build is 18 pally and 2 something... maybe fighter for feats or monk for evasion and stance?  Or is pure pally beneficial?


What is your reason for not going pure? Reason to: Capstone for vanguard or KOTC (both are pretty nice).

Fighter as an option I can see if you really need the feats, but Monk may not be the best option as splash.
You won't get stance if you're wearing heavy armor or using shield. If using heavy/tower shield, or heavy armor, you won't get evasion. I don't think it would be a good choice for 5% HAmp from shintao. So again, only benefit would be 2 feats.

Guess it depends on how much you like the capstones, or how much you need those feats.
  
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Re: SWF Paladin
Reply #9 - Oct 6th, 2014 at 7:00pm
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Kluege wrote on Oct 6th, 2014 at 5:01pm:
Ok, so the requirement just goes away when I am epic level 1?

It will say youre not proficient but equipping the orb will be possible. should be the same in heroic levels.
  

Mockduck wrote on Aug 30th, 2010 at 2:20pm:
I don't think naming names would be a good thing for me to do, but I'd pretty much add anyone who's a know-it-all dick on the list.� Even if they are sometimes intelligent with their opinions, the way they state them in long, "i'm a lawyer at trial"-type posts makes me want to punch them in the face.� They act like whiney babies with god complexes and then freak out if someone so much as breathes criticism in their direction.
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Kluege
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Re: SWF Paladin
Reply #10 - Oct 7th, 2014 at 10:20am
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Rubbinns wrote on Oct 6th, 2014 at 7:00pm:
It will say youre not proficient but equipping the orb will be possible. should be the same in heroic levels.


Cool.  It worked.  Now I have to figure out the enhancements.  I would love to be able to get know the angles, but I am finding it difficult to work that in as well as one of the capstones for Pally.
  
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Dargon
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Re: SWF Paladin
Reply #11 - Oct 7th, 2014 at 10:57am
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My personal layout (TRd into SWF human 20 Pally last night):

41 KOTC
5 Human (dmg boost, cha or con, 10%HAmp)
21 Defender (20% HP and +run speed prioritized)

Have to check when I next log in for what I did with rest of it. It's my first time playing heavy armor in a long time, so I think I have a more points in defender (+6 con, +50% armor AC, +2 CHA). But don't remember for sure. The above numbers are what I see as minimum (for SWF KOTC focus anyway).
  
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Re: SWF Paladin
Reply #12 - Oct 7th, 2014 at 11:20am
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Rubbinns wrote on Oct 6th, 2014 at 3:00pm:
http://www.ddovault.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1407963021/68#68

Magical training isn't needed. I was under that impression on lama that I needed to take it, but I was wrong.



This build is legit.

I took extend vs empower heal b/c i hate recasting angel armor and divine might. The negative to hit for having a orb is not noticable.
  

Skoodge wrote on Nov 4th, 2014 at 5:32am:
A good joke is like a good recipe.  Try using a little less butthurt next time, it throws off the flavor Wink



GermanicusMaximus wrote on Aug 17th, 2014 at 3:52pm:
Why thank you, although I needed no affirmation of that fact from anyone, and certainly not from some sad, fat fuck who is a DDO fanboi.

Having said that, I am a Time Warner stockholder, and every  bit of profit that can be wrung out of Turbine has a chance of increasing my dividend check. As such, I would encourage you to continue spending money on DDO as you attempt to offset the wretched reality that is your life.

Just for your information, not all companies optimize their business operations to maximize current profits. Amazon, for example, is much more interested in increasing its market share at the expense of current profits.

You would know these kinds of things if you were anyone who mattered, but clearly you aren't.

Now, be a good little fanboi and toddle off to the Turbine forums where you can get your daily dose of Cordo ass kissing done.

Hi Welcome
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Kluege
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Re: SWF Paladin
Reply #13 - Oct 7th, 2014 at 12:33pm
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But not having anything into vanguard you lose all that attack speed....
  
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Re: SWF Paladin
Reply #14 - Oct 7th, 2014 at 12:51pm
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Doesn't stack with swf speed
  
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Dargon
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Re: SWF Paladin
Reply #15 - Oct 7th, 2014 at 2:48pm
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Kluege wrote on Oct 7th, 2014 at 12:33pm:
But not having anything into vanguard you lose all that attack speed....


Like Shadehater said, non-stacking. So you'll have greater DPS (I think, haven't run or seen the numbers) going SWF KOTC.


Vanguard is lower DPS with higher defense/survivability, more CC with stuns that can stun all but rednames. It has 1/2 the attack speed total, doesn't get feat bonuses to Melee Power, but has in 10 MP in T5 (Still 10 MP behind KOTC which has 10 MP in capstone). Oh, and Vanguard DOES get WINGS, one of my favorite features (more while leveling), so I'll prob try it on one of my eTRs rounds.
« Last Edit: Oct 7th, 2014 at 2:48pm by Dargon »  
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Re: SWF Paladin
Reply #16 - Oct 7th, 2014 at 2:56pm
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Dargon wrote on Oct 7th, 2014 at 2:48pm:
Like Shadehater said, non-stacking. So you'll have greater DPS (I think, haven't run or seen the numbers) going SWF KOTC.


Vanguard is lower DPS with higher defense/survivability, more CC with stuns that can stun all but rednames. It has 1/2 the attack speed total, doesn't get feat bonuses to Melee Power, but has in 10 MP in T5 (Still 10 MP behind KOTC which has 10 MP in capstone). Oh, and Vanguard DOES get WINGS, one of my favorite features (more while leveling), so I'll prob try it on one of my eTRs rounds.

The S&B builds can get melee power from shield mastery line, or thf line if youre really going for glancing blows.

  

Mockduck wrote on Aug 30th, 2010 at 2:20pm:
I don't think naming names would be a good thing for me to do, but I'd pretty much add anyone who's a know-it-all dick on the list.� Even if they are sometimes intelligent with their opinions, the way they state them in long, "i'm a lawyer at trial"-type posts makes me want to punch them in the face.� They act like whiney babies with god complexes and then freak out if someone so much as breathes criticism in their direction.
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Kluege
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Re: SWF Paladin
Reply #17 - Oct 7th, 2014 at 5:21pm
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I got it up to lvl 23 and so far so good.  I think it will be a heck of lot better when I can get some decent gear on this toon as it is basically an alt.   I do see this going more PRR and MRR than AC.  Actually, my AC is kind of low, but higher on PRR and MRR so it makes up for it.   Cocoon healing and all the buffs you need a decent amount of sp too.
  
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Re: SWF Paladin
Reply #18 - Oct 8th, 2014 at 1:47am
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Rubbinns wrote on Oct 7th, 2014 at 2:56pm:
The S&B builds can get melee power from shield mastery line, or thf line if youre really going for glancing blows.


Oh, didn't notice that change. Nice!

Kluege wrote on Oct 7th, 2014 at 5:21pm:
I got it up to lvl 23 and so far so good.  I think it will be a heck of lot better when I can get some decent gear on this toon as it is basically an alt.   I do see this going more PRR and MRR than AC.  Actually, my AC is kind of low, but higher on PRR and MRR so it makes up for it.   Cocoon healing and all the buffs you need a decent amount of sp too.


Definitely more PRR/MRR based. My AC only hit ~100 (4 martial ePLs), but my P/MRR was hitting 189/69 I think. Only had a chance to try it out in 3BC explorer and thunderholme. Was Super safe in both.
  
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Kluege
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Re: SWF Paladin
Reply #19 - Oct 8th, 2014 at 10:00am
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Dargon wrote on Oct 8th, 2014 at 1:47am:
Definitely more PRR/MRR based. My AC only hit ~100 (4 martial ePLs), but my P/MRR was hitting 189/69 I think. Only had a chance to try it out in 3BC explorer and thunderholme. Was Super safe in both.


My AC sucks atm... only like 50.  My PRR is 170 and MRR is 70.  Although I pretty much get hit all the time, it is not for a lot.  I was doing EH Necro quests at level 23 and 24 and not really get too badly hurt. I did use cocoon a lot more than I am used to, but I pretty much play ranged toons so what do I know...
  
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Kluege
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Re: SWF Paladin
Reply #20 - Oct 8th, 2014 at 10:15am
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Also, I know that for damage it is not the best to run in Unyielding Sentinal, but there is so much healing and lay hands regen, PRR, hp boosts, and AC boosts etc...  Any thoughts on which ED to run and what to twist?  I only have 3 slots on this guy.
« Last Edit: Oct 8th, 2014 at 10:16am by Kluege »  
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Re: SWF Paladin
Reply #21 - Oct 8th, 2014 at 10:48am
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Kluege wrote on Oct 8th, 2014 at 10:15am:
Also, I know that for damage it is not the best to run in Unyielding Sentinal, but there is so much healing and lay hands regen, PRR, hp boosts, and AC boosts etc...  Any thoughts on which ED to run and what to twist?  I only have 3 slots on this guy.


I went with Unyielding Sentinal. It was too hard to turn down the regen smite and LOH. In addition, at tier 4 i think, you get a extra 20% hps. You are basically unkillable which in turn increases your dps. Kinda addition by subtraction. But then again my toon is a 1st life and has no raid gear, or twists.
  

Skoodge wrote on Nov 4th, 2014 at 5:32am:
A good joke is like a good recipe.  Try using a little less butthurt next time, it throws off the flavor Wink



GermanicusMaximus wrote on Aug 17th, 2014 at 3:52pm:
Why thank you, although I needed no affirmation of that fact from anyone, and certainly not from some sad, fat fuck who is a DDO fanboi.

Having said that, I am a Time Warner stockholder, and every  bit of profit that can be wrung out of Turbine has a chance of increasing my dividend check. As such, I would encourage you to continue spending money on DDO as you attempt to offset the wretched reality that is your life.

Just for your information, not all companies optimize their business operations to maximize current profits. Amazon, for example, is much more interested in increasing its market share at the expense of current profits.

You would know these kinds of things if you were anyone who mattered, but clearly you aren't.

Now, be a good little fanboi and toddle off to the Turbine forums where you can get your daily dose of Cordo ass kissing done.

Hi Welcome
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Re: SWF Paladin
Reply #22 - Oct 8th, 2014 at 12:04pm
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3000 Year Old Necromancer wrote on Oct 8th, 2014 at 10:48am:
You are basically unkillable which in turn increases your dps. Kinda addition by subtraction.


Wait, what? It might increase your damage done, but DPS (which is literally Damage Per Second) is way lower in US than in DC. I can understand going in US for some tough-to-live quests, but it does nothing positive to your DPS, only survivability. And yes, I understand that you deal 0 DPS while dead, US still only increases your overall DPS if you keep dying in DC, which shouldn't realistically happen if you know what you're doing.
  
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Re: SWF Paladin
Reply #23 - Oct 8th, 2014 at 12:18pm
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Oyster wrote on Oct 8th, 2014 at 12:04pm:
survivability. And yes, I understand that you deal 0 DPS while dead, .


This ^.
  

Skoodge wrote on Nov 4th, 2014 at 5:32am:
A good joke is like a good recipe.  Try using a little less butthurt next time, it throws off the flavor Wink



GermanicusMaximus wrote on Aug 17th, 2014 at 3:52pm:
Why thank you, although I needed no affirmation of that fact from anyone, and certainly not from some sad, fat fuck who is a DDO fanboi.

Having said that, I am a Time Warner stockholder, and every  bit of profit that can be wrung out of Turbine has a chance of increasing my dividend check. As such, I would encourage you to continue spending money on DDO as you attempt to offset the wretched reality that is your life.

Just for your information, not all companies optimize their business operations to maximize current profits. Amazon, for example, is much more interested in increasing its market share at the expense of current profits.

You would know these kinds of things if you were anyone who mattered, but clearly you aren't.

Now, be a good little fanboi and toddle off to the Turbine forums where you can get your daily dose of Cordo ass kissing done.

Hi Welcome
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Kluege
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Re: SWF Paladin
Reply #24 - Oct 8th, 2014 at 12:37pm
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That was my two choice that I had boiled down to...  DC or US.  I think the best is to run both and see which one I like, then go with that one.  I sometimes get caught up in the numbers and forget to check if it is fun or not.
  
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