Yes it would have. I have no dnd background like some of you guys have so maybe not that big imagination or idea what can be done.

Maybe not "raw numbers" but actual "swordplay" or cool shit.
Paralyze on sneak or Trip after Feint or Huge Crit multiplier on  ( failed ) assassinate.
Some form of even " support cc", cool shit to debuff or cc enemies, or provide some more damage to your companions,  Cetus' thread shows that there might be some interest in that.
I don't know certainly something else than another splash for current "power builds".
My bard ( and he has like 500 various raid completions haha ) has been a mule since Motu.
I have monkcher, twf, twf Blitzer, so I would totally TR into singing hot Drow that isn't another fugging twf build.

Hmmm.  It does have some good points for throwing builds if you really, really don't want to take Monk levels but... no off-hand weapon while you throw stuff 

Vaguely wondering about Bard/Rogue, or even Bard/Rogue/Wiz.  If it went live like this, I would probably play with it.  I have at least one bard build gathering dust along with free LR hearts...

Since this tree is massive fail I am adopting a new name for it, Suckbuckler.

lmao a bard in battle buckler in hand with a rapier, randomly pulls out a lute and starts rockin out, monsters runs away scared

18-20/x3 on any weapon with a 3 bard splash would be interesting... if it didn't exclude paladin and monk splashes.

they have not said yet if this includes IC but since it's like Rogue knife enhancements (as they stated in the thread) that means these weapons are actually going to be 15-20x3.

That's better than a khopesh. That's better than a Rapier. That's better than any 1 handed weapon in the game. And you can choose to use any of those weapon types.

Please tell me oh wise and genius Shadehater, why that's terrible?

harharharhar wrote on Apr 25^th, 2014 at 12:09pm:


think of all the descriptions they could have changed with the man hours wasted on swashbuckler.

Shadehater wrote on Apr 25^th, 2014 at 11:57am:


If they get that crit range (and if it functions correctly with Impoved Critical), then those weapons wouldn't be shitty weapons anymore.  They'd be good weapons.  Because crit range and attack speed are what make up more than 90% of a weapon's value.

It would still be a shitty class in general, but those would absolutely be good weapons once they pick up the new crit profile.

Balizarde Kensei would be 13 - 20 x4. Not too shabby.
Precision bypass, Destruction on weapon,right amount of Doublestrike, that dodge with buckler ...
Maybe epic versions of those Tbc weapons with enhanced crit profiles ( that dagger and shortsword ).
Rebellion is 15- 20 x 2 with IC, 13 -20 Kensei, so 11- 20 x 3 with new Swashbuckle ? Depends how it's gonna work.
Certainly special crit stuff can make some weapons interesting.
Or maybe it's all just shit.

I guess, depends what is gonna stack or not.
Maybe it will be changed to some other bonus type ( like Ravager threat range stacking with Pulverizer ) , would have to pretty good to get people to use it.
Now if Deathnip was light pick.

I think it's going to depend on how they intend "(ignoring other bonuses)"

Revaulting wrote on Apr 25^th, 2014 at 9:08pm:


They've already clarified it here.
So, weapons with extended ranged/higher mult should still have a higher range/higher mult. But those bonuses won't stack with Kensei, Assassin, Halfling, and (unless they changed it recently?) Pulverizer. Might stack with various barbarian bonuses tho, I'm not entierly sure what's the bonus type of those.

qweeve wrote on Apr 26^th, 2014 at 4:33am:


I think Vargouille should be banned for detailing an exploit on those forums.

NOTpopejubal wrote on Apr 25^th, 2014 at 12:30pm:



OK, WTF is this attack speed you speak of? As I understood it, it was based upon the animation sequence. most 1 handed weapons have the same speed, due to animations being the same.