Bigjunk wrote on Jun 18^th, 2013 at 11:14am:

In the short term, sure, lovefest, Turbine can do no wrong for about a week, and we'll have Leslie, Turdh and postumus leading "We love the Devs" parades in the market. Long term? No way. The first time something goes wrong or there is a change, the entire history of the game will get dragged up again by players, all the way back to the WoP nerf or further. Turbine isn't the only leopard in the game, to use rest's comment.

It's like when your kids lie to you. After a while, it doesn't matter if they're telling the truth, you just don't believe anything they say. You're happy when they start being truthful again. But they still have to be consistently honest for a long time before you start automatically believing them again. And you'll always wonder whether they'll relapse, and never quite get back to the same level of trust.

Kimberlite wrote on Jun 18^th, 2013 at 11:26am:


We're a dying breed. 

There are so few of use long-time (and since I started in 2009 I'm not sure I can call myself that) players left and so many new people it's not funny.  If 10% of the active players even remember the Tempest nerfs (for which I'm still bitter) I'd be surprised.

The game's so full of new people who aren't gonna remember the old lies.

Look, i still won't pre-order anything and will buy this so called expansion when it's on sale.

If they are backing down on the ED XP reset, and it looks like they are, it's because they realized it'll cost them more money than it makes them.  This happens to coincide with our interests.

Leslie, Turdh and postumus really do need to die in a fire.  Fanbois of anything are the most terrible people in existence.  My old troll account started that "End of DC casting?" thread and hoards of these "everything is fine idiots" game out saying nothing is wrong.  One update later all we're seeing is Shiradi casters.  Typically the fanibois are too stupid to understand why they are wrong about everything.

i just can't hold a grudge, I'm an asshole who hangs out with other assholes and we all easily forgive each other.  I can let past stupidity of Turbine slide if they actually fix things.

The ENH pass is a start.

ETR without ass-raping ED XP is another start.

Do something to get as an actual end-game and I might even be happy.

AtomicMew wrote on Jun 18^th, 2013 at 12:14am:


I'll take that bet.  An Otto's Box?  EE Visors?  5000 TP code? What do you want to bet?

Kimberlite wrote on Jun 18^th, 2013 at 11:26am:


Honestly, if anyone is still pissed about the WoP nerf or anything from that time period, they need to get a life.  WoP was OP and redonk.  Changes to WoP or auto-crit on held mobs, or vorpals are a game balance issue and that's fine.  Changes to spells like Wail, etc.  Same thing.  Getting butt hurt about this stuff is just stupid. 

Wiping out 20 million ED XP is not a game balance issue.  It's a grind issue.  Screwing up the divine casters entirely in the Enhancment pass is, likewise, not a game balance issue.  Divines were not OP in their DPS or offensive casting.  No one could claim "needs to be nerfed.  Clerics are OP!"   If anything, they needed a little love.  The ONLY original class in the game with 1 PrE, and only a tier 2 PrE at that.  Talk about a red-headed step child. 

Arkat wrote on Jun 18^th, 2013 at 12:00pm:


NewGuy's "they recognize that several players are already very invested in Epic Destinies, this was absolutely part of the early design discussions" statement doesn't instill any confidence.

I don't believe that "Actually "several" may be overstating when we are talking about maxing out all EDs. There is a good portion of players that focus on TR, and others that run only to cap picking up a couple ED's then roll an Alt. There are also casual players that don't play every week and take a very long time to take a character through content." was a typo.

I believe that Glin and the people responsible for the eTR framework revealed in Glin's initial post really believe that it will have a net positive effect on cash flow, and that any bad will generated by it will be confined to the "several" people who will have to re-acquire the ED benefits they already unlocked.

I think someone did a cost-benefit analysis and somehow came to the conclusion that using the same old content but corralling players through a new mechanic for ED progression was "better" than addressing the root cause for the paths that players discovered and chose.


I don't see any evidence of novel thinking on the part of Turbine in that announcement thread.


If Glin had opened with:

Quote:


If Glin had begun the dialogue with something that looked open-ended, he would have gotten most of the same information that's buried in that impossibly long thread, but it wouldn't have been as confrontational.

With some careful steering comments from Varg and Piloto, they probably could have gotten the community to propose the same crap that Glin dumped on us, but they would have had community buy-in.


I'm not seeing anything different here than I've already seen before.

The last time Jerry said "Nothing's set in stone" he was speaking about the possibility of reversing the forum consolidation.

Flav wrote on Jun 18^th, 2013 at 1:37pm:


Jerry is a mouthpiece for the company.  He toes the company line and says what his boss wants him to say.  He's not a dev, and based on his job title, should have little to no say in any major game development decisions.

Flav wrote on Jun 18^th, 2013 at 4:26pm:

Jerry can do little more than that.

Despite his position, Jerry's nothing more than a little weasel without an original, independent thought in that empty space he calls his "mind."

Jerry is the PERFECT corporate mouthpiece for Turbine. He will have a job there for as long as he wants to stay.

Carpone wrote on Jun 18^th, 2013 at 7:30pm:


You should see Sarlona pugs trying to complete EH FOT... heck, EN half the time.

Asheras wrote on Jun 18^th, 2013 at 1:02pm:

How about $10 paypal. 

Here are the terms: if epic TRing results in losing all non-bonded destiny XP ( i.e., current destiny + destiny PL's) or more, you lose.  If epic TRing results in only losing one full destiny (or less) you win. 

Deal? If so, start a new thread on it. 

why not make everybody happy?

powergamers want their time put in capping EDs to be worth something decent, Turbine wants people to play forgotten realms content.

for Epic TR - allow players to bind one ED, then put the rest of the ED XP into a bank.  it can be used in the following ways

a) at par for heroic xp
b) from 20-28 half into epic XP, half into EDs (e.g. spend 100000, 50000 goes to levelling up, 50000 goes to improving EDs)
c) once you're at 28 you can use any towards EDs at par

this would allow fairly decent value for time grinding (particularly with epic TR bonuses tbd and a bound ED).  there would still be quite a bit of time spent between 20-28, which i have to assume is what they want with no endgame raids and multiple new TR options

genius?  madness?

gives lots of options, for instance let's say i want to do heroic completionist but hate running 18-20, i can get 2,000,000 ED xp and just skip that part every life.  if i want to do completionist epic TR, it actually gets shorter every time (depending on xp penalty curve for multiple epic TRs)

painkiller wrote on Jun 19^th, 2013 at 10:30am:


I think it's genius personally. I think it's too easily exploitable (not the right word here as it's not an 'exploit' but it's the best I could come up with) but it sounds like that's the direction they want to go with things. I honestly wouldn't mind them doing the same thing on heroic TR's. Basically it takes away one thing - the ability to level to 20 and immediately have all epic destinies. But honestly that part's always been a bit hokey.

What it gives you is choices. If you didn't want to regrind ED's you have the choice to level back to 28 and have all your destinies back immediately. If you'd rather skip the beginning levels you have that as an option. Honestly I'd be tempted to do that not because of time but because of the parabolic nature of xp. I can burn less than a million xp out of nearly 20 million to get back to greensteel? Yes please!

I'm still in the camp that they should just go with option 2 from their most recent post but that's more because I trust them to implement it without mistakes or easily exploitable loopholes than that I think it's the better system for the players.

I'm still giggling at Glin's "several people" comment. Bless him.

If I could, y'know, stay logged in for any length of time I would pop in to say more casual players that have worked on epic Destinies at all would be even more in the "fuck that, I'm not TRing" camp. Certainly I have neither the time not the energy to devote 40 hrs or so to Rusted Blades farming...

Flav wrote on Jun 19^th, 2013 at 1:03pm:


Agreed...looking at the LOTRO forums shows that there are people at Turbine who give a fuck. Cordo is not that person. Neither is Tolero. MajMal IS doing that job. IS being a community rep and at least talking to the playerbase about the issues.